MLIS Sucks Ass!

topic posted Fri, June 17, 2005 - 2:37 AM by  Luna Bean
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I am hating my MLIS classes. I keep hearing that Library school is no reflection on the job place, that things get better. Can anyone out there give a poor student the scoop. I go to San Jose State, and believe I'm getting a terrible educaction. Unfortunately there aren't a lot of Library schools.
posted by:
Luna Bean
Los Angeles
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  • Re: MLIS Sucks Ass!

    Fri, June 17, 2005 - 7:23 AM
    I had an assistant just finish her MLIS about a month ago at the University of Alabama (she is now the Librarian at the Federal District Court in Atlanta). So I heard many complaints about the program, the classes being dated and not practical, etc. I had to agree with her assessment. I finished my degree in 1992 - back before we had the web, etc. My goal was to be a Reference Librarian (academic) so I took every refrence class offered as well as Special Librariesand found these to be extremely beneficial in the long run. My career started in academics, but I have been a Law Librarian at a firm firm for the last 7 years and *love* my job.

    Personally, I think the ALA needs to revamp their Accreditation program/standards, update the classes, then add a requirement for internships/co-ops or practicums. Check to see if there are Internships available through your program.

    Helen.
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    Re: MLIS Sucks Ass!

    Fri, June 17, 2005 - 10:43 AM
    It really is too bad that there aren't more library schools on the west coast; I got my MLIS from UCLA a few years ago, and for the most part I really enjoyed the program. My focus was on sound archives and music librarianship, but lo and behold I've been a reference librarian in a public library for the last 3 years. I didn't take a single class that was specifically about public libraries, so I can't really speak for any "disconnect" between school and the workplace; I will say though that I'm ready to go back to school for my subject masters...
    • Re: MLIS Sucks Ass!

      Fri, June 17, 2005 - 3:12 PM
      I got my MLIS in 03 from UA and just quit my job at Alabama State. I have to say that the seminars are very related to professional issues one might face in an academic environment. A lot of the "skills" are rather rudimentary, but if one enters the workforce with another masters, they are a cakewalk. I think being a "user" of libraries makes one a better librarian. I think a subject masters referred to in the above post would make one a better public or academic librarian. Masters degrees, are after all, in theory, teaching degrees. And public libraries, are to a large degree, an extention of the academy.
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      Re: MLIS Sucks Ass!

      Fri, June 17, 2005 - 4:00 PM
      That's interesting. I went into library school with a bachelor's of music and thought I could go into academic music librarianship -- little did I know that most academic libraries require a master's degree in the subject area you want to be a librarian for! So I changed focus and now I'm a children's librarian in a public library setting. There was no requirement for an internship, but I did one on my own because I had only worked in academic libraries, and boy was that a lifesaver. I found that once I got a job I pretty much learned what the rules were and then made most of everything else up! I WILL say, though, that the heavy focus on theory I had in my program (at UW) has helped me to understand what I'm doing every day much, much better. At the time I was pissed and disillusioned and felt like I wouldn't know what I was doing when I got a job in a public library, but I actually recognize now (having spoken to co-workers who got their degrees elsewhere) that I had a really, really good education.

      Too bad the pay is so shitty!!!
      • Re: MLIS Sucks Ass!

        Fri, June 17, 2005 - 8:50 PM
        Thanks for the input guys. And yes, it is too bad the pay is so shitty, considering you need a masters degree and they don't come cheap.
      • Re: MLIS Sucks Ass!

        Tue, April 4, 2006 - 2:52 PM
        I entered SI-UM with my BA in Music in hand, and the full intent to become a Music Librarian. One of the reasons I went to U-Mich was because the School of Music Library has such a fantastic reputation. In my first term, I took Music Bibliography and worked at the Music Library in Circ. Unfortunately, those were the only aspects of that semester and the program that I didn't loathe. The School of Information is all about theory and academia, and little else. When the Head Librarian of the Music Library told me that there were no jobs in music librarianship, that I would still need an MM (probably in Musicology), and that I should just go into public librarianship, I was... not impressed.

        So I dropped from the program and took a job as a Ready Reference clerk at the local public library. I then transferred to Wayne State University. I'm finishing up my second term there, and then there's just one more to go before I graduate in late July. I absolutely love the program. The curriculum, the teachers-- everything has been perfect, and so much better than at the University of Michigan. However, this program really is geared mostly towards future public librarians, with a little thrown in for academic and school libraries. Any other Information Science &/or Theory major would feel really unprepared to enter the field after following this program, just as all of the future "people" librarians who graduate from SI-UM feel completely unprepared, and somewhat bitter.

        I definitely agree that there needs to be a new process of-- if not accrediting, at least *labeling* library schools in this country. I found it very difficult to figure out what each school was really about from just reading the literature.
    • Re: MLIS Sucks Ass!

      Sat, June 23, 2007 - 10:32 AM
      UCLA seems to be shifting away from publuc librarianship despite the cries from most of us students. We are trying to get our voices heard.
  • Re: MLIS Sucks Ass!

    Sat, June 18, 2005 - 10:19 AM
    I'm a '98 grad of SJSU and found the classes both good and so-so. (I have to say I was concerned about the new director...) I knew I wanted to work as a special librarian so I focused on related subjects. In one class, Collection Development, a few of us KEPT having to remind the prof to include special libraries in his lectures...he'd mention "in an academic library blah blah, in a public/school library..." etc. but not other libraries. Not sure what your focus is...& maybe the quality has just gone down in the last few years. I guess if you want advice, try to get the most kick-ass internship and work that for all it's worth (recommendation, experience, etc.). Hope this helps...questions? let me know.
    • Re: MLIS Sucks Ass!

      Sun, June 19, 2005 - 6:41 PM
      I was quite miserable in library school. The quality of education was fine at UBC but the huge amount of nitpicky assignments and super boring reading almost killed me. My wonderful classmates got me through. Some of the best and most interesting people are librarians!

      I have worked in public libraries for 9 years, 5 of them as a children's librarian and I still love the field. I wanted to work in career which would enable me to contribute to community empowerment and I feel I have achieved that. It is also personally very rewarding. The variety of reference questions and the evolution of our programming and services is inspiring.

      But you're right, we aren't paid enough!
  • Re: MLIS Sucks Ass!

    Wed, June 22, 2005 - 1:23 PM
    I am hating my current mlis class - but mostly cause i hate politics & management and that's what we have to cover! Otherwise, I've had really good luck - do you know about the yahoo groups page that reviews sjsu instructors in the mlis program???? definitely worth reading before you sign up for classes - let me know and I'll dig up the link.

    I think i'm halfway through the credential piece, with another 4 to take after that for master's. grrrr....i'm just sick of school right now period!

    I can give you tips on professors i've had if it'll help - let me know! and good luck -
    • Re: MLIS Sucks Ass!

      Wed, June 22, 2005 - 4:35 PM
      I would love any information you have about what professors to take or avoid. I just took a class with Pro. Liu, and it was deadly.
      • Re: MLIS Sucks Ass!

        Wed, August 24, 2005 - 8:19 PM
        I went to the University of Maryland (albeit 10 years ago) and found the best classes were with people who were actually out there working in the field and came in to teach one class a week. The tenured professors weren't really dialed into current technology practices.

        Unfortunately, you need that "accredited" degree to get jobs, which is where the real learning begins.
      • Re: MLIS Sucks Ass!

        Fri, December 23, 2005 - 7:18 PM
        Hi Luna,

        I am almost finished with the MLIS at SJSU. I am taking two classes next semester and then will culminate. I had a couple really good professors like karatsu/perera for 210 Reference and Le Conge and Peck for 261 and 262. But stay away from Duran for any class, I also hear the same about Dowlin. If you log into Yahoo, there is a SJSU SLIS group that you can join. In the group, there is a database with comments and feedback about classes and professors. It really helped me a lot. Let me know if you have any questions;)
  • Re: MLIS Sucks Ass!

    Thu, August 25, 2005 - 10:19 PM
    You guys should read the book "Revolting Librarians" written about library schools and the trials and tribulations of the profession. I found it very funny indeed!
    • No it doesn't

      Fri, September 2, 2005 - 8:17 PM
      I'm from the East Coast, so I can't speak to your program. I went to University of Rhode Island. I got my degreee in '91, so I guess it makes me old school. I found that it helped me professionally to be prepared for the workplace. I tracked academic, technical services, cataloging.

      Some of the reading was really interesting -- I especially like Sanford Berman, Carol Tenofir (sp) work. But yes, some of it was deadly boring. I read fiction like a maniac to keep my mind agile.

      The group projects did drive me insane.

      My favorite things were doing a internship at Brown University in cataloging. Cataloged in 8 languages and got 3 credits. I also lead my comps study group. That's when it all came together for me. I also loved my research paper -- I wrote 2 on expert systems one for cataloging, one for reference.

      The students rock. I had the best people in my program. In comparison, when I went for my subject -- English MA -- I could not believe the fucking backbiting and sabotage that occurred. I was very appreciative of my MLIS program then.

      And professors -- what can I tell you -- some of them don't get that it's a performance as well as a presentation. And that's gone across every degree program and subject. Some people are really great lecturers, some are as dry as toast...

      Academia out here is starting to get really kick ass pay 50k +. I've also done business consulting. Just having the degree made a real difference. I've also taught English, lit, and film on the college level -- my deparment head respected my Masters. I'm out of the field right now full-time, but consulting is paying well.

      This is the way I look at it. For most of my life I've been able to be a public servant and do what I love. Most people aren't that lucky. And as for the pay, folks, I come from a blue collar background and as we used to say in the English department it beats digging ditches.

      And listen to this -- most of us are pretty cool. And I can say without reservation that I've done things as a librarian that have changed people's lives.

      I actually started a library at a literacy program 10 years ago and was recently pretty thrilled to find out that it had evolved into a learning resources center.

      Tips -- make the most of your opportunities, take the chance to make things happen, and get involved with student library organizations (ALA, and any regional or state orgs). Once I started interacting people in my field I got really excited. And it definitely helped people get to know me.

      If you don't like it get out, but if you're committed it can be a great ride!
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    Re: MLIS Sucks Ass!

    Sat, September 3, 2005 - 10:03 AM
    I feel your pain!! I've heard some pretty negative stuff about SJSU's program but try to focus on the end result -- a degree that will help you get the job that you want.

    I was lucky enough to finish my MLIS program with Archives Administration emphasis (1993) while UC Berkeley still had a library school. My internships and practicums made the classes I took relevant and I had good instructors as well.

    However, you really don't learn how to work in the real library world until you get out there and have a permanent job. In the workplace, your department head and colleagues provide the support and expanded learning opportunities that enable you to put into practice what you learned in library school.

    So, all I can say is "hang in there" and try to do some practicums that get you into a real workplace so you can start seeing that there is an end in sight.

    Oh ya, we librarians are a great bunch -- funky, funny, and always looking for opportunities to share information and help our fellow MLIS'ers.

    And, for a humorous "take" on library school, check out the Stick Library:

    www.queenazura.com/sticklib...ndex.html
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      Re: MLIS Sucks Ass!

      Sat, September 3, 2005 - 8:15 PM
      I have just started my MLS degree at Indiana University and my first week has been great. The professors expect a lot out of us and it's going to hard work, but they are helpful and their door is always open. I work at the life sciences library as well, and my boss and the other people that I work with are great.

      So far the stuff I have done in my classes is ranges from interesting to kinda boring. But I think any program is like that.

      I may update later when I've been in the program longer.
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      Re: MLIS Sucks Ass!

      Sun, September 4, 2005 - 11:12 AM
      Oh ya, I also worked in libraries from the time I was an undergrad and all through library school so I was able to see how the coursework I was taking fit in with the real work environment.

      The real irony of all this is that I was a part time library assistant in the periodicals department at the same library I now work in as the Periodicals/Reference Librarian!!!

      Talk about full circle. I worked as an Archivist in a non-profit for 5 1/2 years after I got my degree in '93 but, when a new librarian position was created at my former institution I went for it and got hired in '98. It felt like coming home. Been there ever since and loving it. We also have an archives that I get to work in as part of my professional development.

      Couldn't have done any of this without the masters degree so it is important to hang in there.
      • Re: MLIS Sucks Ass!

        Tue, April 4, 2006 - 9:44 AM
        Is it the actual work you do now that you couldn't have done without the MLIS education?

        I have worked a total of 7 years in Serials/Electronic Resources (granted, 4 of those were part time student assistant, but involved virtually all clerk duties I was given when hired full time). From the three MLIS classes I have taken, and observation of library work, I really don't think the information that is taught in the degree is directly necessary for me to complete the duties of a "professional" librarian. At least as far as Acquisitions-type work is concerned, experience, and maybe a business degree, would go much further than the MLIS.

        I don't mean to be rude or disrespectful to the degree/field, but it is very frustrating for supervisors and management to ignore your skills and potential just because you haven't spent thousands of dollars to create eleborate bored doodles in reference class!
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          Re: MLIS Sucks Ass!

          Fri, April 7, 2006 - 5:46 PM
          Megan,

          Yes, the actual work I do is MLIS librarian work and it *is* different than the type of work library assistants do, at least where I work. I've also been a library assistant and it's not that I couldn't do the work I do now without the degree, it's that the work becomes more meaningful now that I have my MLIS. So the MLIS is important, in spite of the fact that the degree program can be mind numbing, depending on where you go to school. Try to look at it as a means to an end.

          Also, the amount of money you make as well as professional development and promotion opportunities are tied to that degree. How much room for advancement or change in your duties do you have in a support staff position? How much input do you have in policy development or implementation? How much time do you spend thinking about collection development or how to relate user needs to information availability? Do you teach and consult? Do you sit down with the Dean or Director of the library and have him/her listen to you in discussions of the future of the print collection or the need for legal knowledge in the signing of licensing agreements. If you went to another institution with the same job description, would not the work be similar to what you are already doing?

          Don't get me wrong, the work that library assistants do is sooo valuable and worhwhile, no library could function without good support staff (or student assistants, for that matter). And I loved my job when I was and L.A., but it had its limits.

          However, librarianship is a profession, not just a job, so that is one thing to remember as you work toward your degree. When you are a librarian, you must see yourself as part of the library, the institution and the community as well as a member of the profession. You don't just complete tasks in the workplace, you make sure to see the bigger picture. And do you really think business classes would be any more interesting than some of the classes in library school?

          I think this discussion is an ongoing one that both librarians and library assistants will be involved in for a very long time so it's good that you asked. I wish you well and hope that you can find meaningful work once you have that degree in your hand!

          Cheers!
          • Re: MLIS Sucks Ass!

            Mon, April 10, 2006 - 9:16 AM
            Deb,

            I really appreciate your position. Thanks for responding! This is definitely a topic larger than these posts. I just wish that there was more fluidity between para- and professional positions. For the record, I have attended many local meetings and conferences (that I could afford!), internal committee meetings, and keep current on professional issues. I don't feel that the degree would necessarily make me any more interested and involved in the profession than I already am. But it would offer, as you said, more opportunity for financially assisted professional development, greater attention from supervisors and respect for my opinions on issues relating to the development of the library.

            Again, thanks for being impartial and not taking offense! I am happy that the profession, and discussion of such, thrives! My best to you, as well!
            • Re: MLIS Sucks Ass!

              Tue, April 11, 2006 - 12:24 AM
              Hey Megan,

              I'm just writing a quick note, but feel free to email me if you'd like more info.

              I was a Serials Librarian for 3 years. The quality of MLIS classes really depends on what you're taking. For me the 2 Catalogng classes were incredibly helpful, as was the admin classes. I got to do a great internship at Brown which was wonderful for me. Yep some things made my brain bleed, but my best friend has his MBA and he hated the classes. It all depends on what you want to do with your life.

              I'm actually not working as a librarian right now. My degree has always opened doors in business. It shows people that you have discipline. Think of it as an investment in your future -- for whatever degree you take. I've worked on 2 Year 2000 projects and now have worked as an analyst, project manager, and technical writer/editor.

              I totally understand your frustration. Paraprofessionals aren't given the respect they deserve. Some academic institutions have classified librarians positiions that you can take exams for. I understand your frustration, but if you want to advance in this field you need the degree. Period. I think some education classes are a little bogus, but it's required by most states board of ed. Professional and governmental agencies have worked very diligently to make the concentration of professionals part of states aid grants. They've helped lift up wages in many states. Most places public librarians aren't even on a par with school teachers. I understand your feelings of bogus ness of the degree, but I think you need to decide what you want to do and get the training to do it. Even if you switch fields the attention to detail and process-oriented workflows you've participated in will serve you well where ever you go.

              Good luck!
              Robin
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    Re: MLIS Sucks Ass!

    Thu, July 5, 2007 - 6:37 AM
    I am currently in my last year of library school in New York. Here are some of my observations to the issues you brought up....

    A) as for the number and quality of library schools in the US, I believe that there is certainly room for improvement. Many people are forced to attend a particular school of out necessity (ie. location, price range) but as long as it is ALA accredited it is better for you in the long run. As several people have mentioned, i do believe it is time for ALA to revamp standards and revise the curriculum. With input from its members we can surely make this happen sooner rather than later.

    B) do not forget that taking the actual classes is only one aspect of immersing oneself in libraryland. Make it a point to join the professional organizations that interest you, and take note of networking and discussion groups. I have found this a valuable way to get the "real life perspective" that cannot be gleaned from our enthralling course books :)

    C) INTERNSHIP, INTERNSHIP, INTERNSHIP! or VOLUNTEER! by far this will be the most rewarding experience you can engage in short of actually being employed in an information intensive environment. Even if this is not a requirement for your program, and as long as you can fit it into your schedule, this is nothing but a good thing.

    D) I have learned the hard way that many schools face a shortage of qualified professors. What happens is they will bring in highly qualified professionals from within their respective fields instead. In my opinion, this isn't always such a great idea since while these people are clearly fantastic librarians/record managers/archivists etc, they aren't necessarily good teachers. And that makes all the difference between an engaging and dynamic learning environment and an evening when you'd rather brush your teeth with barbed wire.

    the moral is: as librarians we are stewards of past, present, and future information dissemination; library school but one phase of a very exhaustive field....hang in there.
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    Re: MLIS Sucks Ass!

    Tue, July 29, 2008 - 5:26 PM
    I have spent the last six weeks killing myself building blogs, websites, writing presentations, writing a 20 page research paper and reading literally thousands of pages of infomation.

    Yesterday, I had an A+ in one class. This morning that grade dropped to a low A. I will end up with a B because it is matematically impossible to raise the grade at this time. Tutition went up over $200 per class.

    The SLIS department seems baffled that I could have a tenured position as a librarian and therefore asks me to interview numerous inidividuals for a job I already have.

    I am spent and completely dishearten by the whole experience. The only real asset I can take from this experience is the realization that my school site values me as a librarian more than SJSU values me as a student.

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