hi all... a question for the group?

topic posted Mon, November 7, 2005 - 5:06 PM by  gr
I have a friend in my program (tech theatre) who is *very* interested in working as a cinematographer. As I understand, she has no formal experience in the area yet, but from what I've seen of her work, she is capable, talented and dedicated. Live theatre and film have similar basics, and I believe she's doing the tech theatre major. Late teens, if I recall...

I've invited her to this tribe (and others), and am not sure when she'll be on. In the meantime, does anyone have ideas on how I can help her get started in the field? From what I've seen, she puts both work and creativity into her projects, and I think she'd be a good person to get working with. I realize that no one knows me in the PDX area yet, but I've got a pretty solid rep as a sound designer in northern California. Can't really afford to jeopardize that on an unknown, but I think she's got talent.

Any thoughts or suggestions would be most welcome, and I'll pass anything useful on to her. Thanks for your time, and as a shameless self-plug (I really have *no* shame), I'm available for custom sound design. If you can vaguely describe what you'd like to hear, I'll make it for you ahead of deadline... :P

- k
posted by:
gr
offline gr
Portland
  • Re: hi all... a question for the group?

    Mon, November 7, 2005 - 6:33 PM
    Off the top of my head, I'd suggest she find someone who has a simple script, nothing too complicated, and she just shoot it. Get started in on a portfolio of some kind.
    • Re: hi all... a question for the group?

      Tue, November 8, 2005 - 9:26 AM
      great idea and suggestion Edward. I would also suggest that she gets a decent camera of her own and just start writing story boards and pick one, make a short film. Documentary even..

      Thats what Im doing, I have about 5 short films, 20-30 minutes each..all a little different genre.
      • gr
        gr
        offline 19

        Re: hi all... a question for the group?

        Tue, November 8, 2005 - 9:38 AM
        question on gear... any recommendations for a tight budget? Anyone willing to do some fundamental training? I remember what it was like when I first started doing digital sound work back in '88, and I had to train myself. Probably took way too long, but I understood the basics fairly well from analog design. I don't know what her experience with gear is like, and it'd be nice if she didn't have to buy something too complex, rather than a good start and a learning tool. I like to help when I can, but I know almost nothing about cameras 'n' such, except for some video gear.

        Is there anyone here who could help someone new get her feet on the ground? I know she needs to develop a portfolio, but she does need to start somewhere... Thanks!

        - k
        • Re: hi all... a question for the group?

          Tue, November 8, 2005 - 5:25 PM
          Well, I can probably be talked into offering a script or part-of a script.

          If she doesn't mind starting at the bottom, she can shoot samples using a Handicam. Anything. Well lit, well shot work, even if done using a Handicam, is often enough to get someone a little more work on shorts or locally.
          • Unsu...
             

            Re: hi all... a question for the group?

            Tue, December 27, 2005 - 2:51 PM
            i would love to collaborate, if she needs help with another hopeful and novice cinematographer. i am in eugene, i have access to some video equipment thru the university. help?
    • Re: hi all... a question for the group?

      Tue, November 8, 2005 - 5:04 PM
      i would sugjest that this friend try and find a DP that would be will to teach them to how to be an AC.

      or contact one of the camera rental places around town to see if they have an internship opening up.

      this friend is going to need to learn about camera and meet people in the film industry around town.

      taking some classes is a good way to get into the mind set.
      there is a lot to learn.

      she also is going to remember to just keep trying.
  • Gil
    Gil
    offline 2

    Re: hi all... a question for the group?

    Wed, November 9, 2005 - 1:43 PM
    I actually have a small production group that I work with and we are getting ready to produce a short film in the next few months or so. I could ask my DP if he'd be willing to take someone under wing.

    Getting a foot in the door is a long process. But once you meet the right people and become part of making things happen you'll find it gets easier.

    The suggestion of getting into a production of people who are already making films is probably the best way to break in. I'd be willing to talk to my group in the next production meeting and set up a meeting with this young lady in order to get her started and to see if she's a good fit for us.

    Feel free to contact me: gmluna@12to12studios.com
    • Re: hi all... a question for the group?

      Thu, November 24, 2005 - 7:46 AM
      the original post said that the person was interested in being a cinematographer, not a videographer.

      if that is the case, shooting film is not just a matter of going out and shooting. it means learning about film stocks, about lighting, about light meters, about film cameras... and about pre-planning, unless there is unlimited money available.

      though lighting for video is somewhat easier due to the use of monitors and being able to see real-time what one is doing, learning to light is still the central skill of a cinematographer or videographer. And even with video - without calibrated monitors, one is really guessing when relying on the camera to know what a scene is going to look like. there are good books out there on lighting though one needs to really start to "see" lighting and how it is functioning in every kind of situation.

      somehow, improved technology leads to some erroneous assumptions about how this medium works - learning to edit isn't about learning to use final cut, it's about learning to tell a story. and learning to shoot still means learning to light, at least it should...
      • Re: hi all... a question for the group?

        Fri, December 2, 2005 - 3:17 PM
        david is right.
        the big thing is learning that there is a lot to learn.
        a lot more than just buying a miniDV camera and hitting record.
        there are also people to meet.

        if this friend is going to actually give it a shot she/he needs to work under a real cinematographer.
        • Re: hi all... a question for the group?

          Fri, December 2, 2005 - 4:11 PM
          these are 2 good posts and serious things to follow up on, lighting, most commonly taken for granted, next to lack of story board in the edit process.


          all this talk about final cut though, whats all the hype? I know it was the monopoly of serious video editting back in the day, but Sony Vegas blows FCP out of the way....
          does it not?
          • gr
            gr
            offline 19

            Re: hi all... a question for the group?

            Fri, December 2, 2005 - 5:46 PM
            Tools are only as good as the person using them, and while one can teach technique, only time and experience can teach taste and quality. As far as FCP and Vegas are concerned, for those of us that refuse to work on Windows machines (I prefer a stable system myself), Apple's software is a standard for a reason.

            It's a matter of personal taste and style, but ultimately the software doesn't matter. I've seen projects built in older versions of Premiere that blow away newer ones built in high-end systems. It's all in how you use the tools you have available. If you don't have an eye for telling a story, it doesn't matter what software (or hardware, for that matter) you use. Sometimes the best work comes from the simplest tools used by someone who knows that they're just a means to an end.

            As for me, I'll stay with the Mac OS till I expire. Had one too many crashes on Windows boxes at critical times (pretty embarassing to miss deadlines because the OS gets uppity), and I can't afford to lose any more work to an OS which is not designed for stability. Besides, it's nice not having to worry about virii...

            - k
            • Re: hi all... a question for the group?

              Fri, December 2, 2005 - 8:11 PM
              this is a good perspective, thanks. It makes good sense too, it didnt really click that maybe FCP was designed for mac.
              I should probably start to learn the mac world then
              I havent had many OS issues with my pc. I built it myself and have maintained and upgraded over the years and seems to hold up fine.
              The virus world can be a drag, no doubt!

          • Re: hi all... a question for the group?

            Sun, December 4, 2005 - 1:41 PM
            Vegas is a cool program.
            for the most part.

            however, FCP does not and did not have the monopoly on serious video editing.

            in portland lots of people are using it but the monopoly is AVID.

            Vegas is just another low priced editor that has come along.
            • Re: hi all... a question for the group?

              Sun, December 18, 2005 - 9:00 PM
              Avid has had market domination in the NW for many years, primarily due to marketing, not necessarily for superior performance. And it was a lot more expensive until Apple upped their competition in the software market with FCP and their other video professional tools to a point that caused Adobe to take Premiere out of the Mac market, and induced other companies like Avid and Discreet to drop their prices. That's not to knock it, however; it's a great tool. I happen to concur about FCP being *overall* the best choice for the stability reasons mentioned above. I've been a PC user since DOS 5.0, installed and used every MS OS since then, built hundreds of PCs, was a certified Microsoft Sales Specialist as well as an Apple Specialist, and sold Apple video solutions for the local VAR. I've worked directly with people from all the companies I've mentioned here, and others, too, been to all the tradeshows, etc...i.e. I've got a lot of knowledge on the marketing side of the video tools industry.

              Since OS X, I've been an Apple convert. I still own my PC desktop but mostly use my G4 powerbook. I like having both platforms.

              The post about a tool just being a tool is quite right. I happen to think the best tool *for the dollar* is a dual G5 with FCP. However, if money is no object, you could consider Flame on an SGI....but I digress.

              I don't know much about Vegas, but the remark about it being another low priced editor that has come along is probably an accurate assessment. It's not an industry standard by any stretch, and has an uphill battle to carve out some market segment to make it a safe choice I'd make. A classice example of Sony trying to explore a new market, like Kodak or Nikon or Olympus trying to make photo editing software. (but Kodak is another sad tale). Unlike Apple, Sony is known only for hardware, and should stick to what they do best. Apple, on the other hand makes great hardware AND software.

              my $.02

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