Syncretic worship

topic posted Mon, May 12, 2008 - 11:37 PM by  ellen
Does anyone use Christian images in their worship/practice? I ask for two reasons. One, I was raised by an Irish American mom that was very, very Catholic, making me something of a "cultural Catholic". I am comfortable around, and comforted by, Catholic images, even though I don't subscribe to Christianity and never have, not even as a child.

Also, I practiced in Afro-Cuban and Afro-Brazilian traditions for a few years and Catholic images were commonly used. (St. Barbara represented Chango, St. Michael was Ogum, etc). I also noticed this in Guatemala, where the Indians seems to conduct worship in Catholic churches as well as on the hillside, Shamans will go light candles in the church as part of their practice, etc.

I have never been to Ireland and no very little about the ways people practice there. Can anyone enlighten me on this?
posted by:
ellen
SF Bay Area
  • Re: Syncretic worship

    Tue, May 13, 2008 - 12:34 AM
    This is a question often asked, as Christianity is the "main" religion of the western world. I can only say the things I was taught and my personal experiences and hope that helps you find yourself. i was raised as a catholic and went to a convent school, and I felt close to the Gods in which ever way they manifest themselves always. I was just 13 when I made the conscious break with catholocism and saw it for what it was, a set of man made rules which had little to do with the worship and praise of God. I still have my communion cross, but that is more to do with the memory of my grandparents that gave it to me. The catholic practice of lighting candles comes from the way Celtic and Germanic tribes worshipped, as fire was sacred to them, and the christians had to make their relkigion acceptable to the people they were trying to convert.
    As a general rule, Celtic worship is conducted outside, for it is the opinion of the ancient ones that the worship of the Gods cannot be conducted in any man made structure with a roof. Most modern day Celtic pagans worship outside whenever possible, but also have an altar, or candle corner for smaller devotions. it is advisable to always have something seasonal at the altars at home, like flowers, as that pleases the Gods. But devotions can be done at any time, even walking along and appreciating nature around you and giving thanks that you are a part of this beautiful world. Any gesture is appreciated. When conducting a ceremony, whether I am alone or leading the devotions in a group, I stretch my arms wide, upward towards the sky, to channel my energy and receive the blessings of the Gods. i can't tell you what is right or wrong, all I can tell you is how my family have celebrated their religion for centuries. I hope you find your way!
    Peace, love and blessings, Michy
    • Re: Syncretic worship

      Tue, May 13, 2008 - 8:30 AM
      Ellen, I agree with MIchy. I to was raised a Cathlic and even as a child I always wondered if God made everything around us why is it wrong to worship nature. Isn t worshipping nature an act of gratitude towards that Being that made it? My grandparents "spoke''Catholic but they acted Pagan. Planting and harvesting with the mooncycles etc...a deep reverence for nature..
      In my own circle, women only, women come from Masonic, Christian, Jewish and Mormon backgrounds and several of them include Mary in their worship as the Primordeal Goddess.
      I left Catholicism because I found it to be a religion of men and not of people. All about money, well at least in my parish, and appearances.. When you read Mists of Avalon, this one sentence comes back several times Religion is kindness, faith is love.
      And I did not find that in Catholicism and it was that sentence that put me good and well on the path again.
      • Re: Syncretic worship

        Tue, May 13, 2008 - 3:23 PM
        For many years I had an altar with a marble plaque on the Virgin of Guadalupe as my goddess image. Later, I had a conversation with a painter-nun about her painting of this apparition of Mary in which she outlined how most of the imagery is actually from the native cultures in Mexico and how it was appropriated by the Catholics. Remember too that many of the 'saints' are actually Christianized gods and goddesses. Brigid is the first to come to mind.

        I have a Hindu friend who regularly prays to Mary & Jesus under the simple rationale that "well, maybe they'll help too.... isn't that their job?" If you believe that those who have died don't have to 'go away' then I think it's quite acceptable to pray to anyone you think might help... regardless of whose faith they "belong" to. If a particular image works for you then use it- it's just an image.


        www.SilverSunbeam.etsy.com
  • Re: Syncretic worship

    Tue, May 13, 2008 - 3:29 PM
    I don't use Christian images, but I love churches and their rituals, particularly of the "bells and smells" variety, being brought up high anglican. I never got the jesus thing and the dogma (the old welsh tales made more sense to me), but the associations with childhood spiritual awakening are very powerful and not to be dismissed.
    • Re: Syncretic worship

      Tue, May 13, 2008 - 4:24 PM
      I sometimes keep a Jesus candle on my altar. One of those gaudy Mexican icon-a-palooza models, with the ladder and the rooster, etc. I had a lovely fly-by Jesus energy moment once, and I've always liked the message of the dude.

      Never cared for his salesmen though. ;-)
      • Re: Syncretic worship

        Tue, May 13, 2008 - 5:20 PM
        I like how you put that Agnus.
        I believe that long ago there lived a man by the name of Jesus who was a very kind and generous person with many skills.
        I dont believe in the man Jesus that the church is trying to turn him into.
        I don t remember where but I read somewhere that if Jesus were to come back he would be an eco-feminist.
        • Re: Syncretic worship

          Tue, May 13, 2008 - 9:55 PM
          There's a great Woodie Guthrie song to that effect.

          Jesus was a man/ who traveled through the land / hard working man and true....

          can't remember the rest.
  • Re: Syncretic worship

    Wed, May 14, 2008 - 7:55 PM
    Historically -- in ancient times, not just recent history -- many heathens in northern Europe included Christian images on their altars. They considered Jesus and Jehovah two among many gods. There are even archaeological finds that show jewelry makers were using the same die to case Thor's hammers and Christian crosses. Of course, there were some who objected to heathens adopting the Christian god. There is some thought, though, that when the heathens conquered Rome and took over the empire -- which was then one with the Christian church -- that they remade Christianity in their own image. So a good case could be made for heathens of today practicing both Christianity and heathenry.
    • Re: Syncretic worship

      Wed, May 14, 2008 - 10:50 PM
      The most popular form I know of was Aryanism, claiming that Jesus was the son of the Hebrew God - who was percieved as the supreme God in the same fashion as Zeus et al. - in the same way that Heracles was the son of Zeus. The gothic emperors were part of that sect - guys like Theodoric in the sixth century, but it was around as early as the fifth when Augustine was really vocal about how the Aryan belief needed to be quashed. There were so many heterodoxies at that time that it's hard to call orthodoxy the dominant religion until it was deliberately made so.
      • Re: Syncretic worship

        Sun, May 25, 2008 - 7:13 PM
        "Arianism is the teachings of the Christian theologian Arius (c. AD 250-336), who lived and taught in Alexandria, Egypt, in the early 4th century. The most controversial of his teachings, considered contrary to the Nicene creed and heretical by the Council of Nicaea, dealt with the relationship between God the Father and the person of Jesus, saying that Jesus was not one with the father, and that he was not fully, although almost, divine in nature. This teaching of Arius conflicted with trinitarian christological positions which were held by the Church (and subsequently maintained by the Roman Catholic Church, the Eastern Orthodox Churches and most Protestant Churches)."

        Quoted from Wikipedia.

        I read about the Arian heresy a couple of months ago and it struck me as fundamental and really got me thinking. What if the Arian teaching had been accepted instead?
    • Re: Syncretic worship

      Thu, May 15, 2008 - 2:28 AM
      "So a good case could be made for heathens of today practicing both Christianity and heathenry."

      And for Christian's practicing paganism, though they don't like being told :-)
      • Re: Syncretic worship

        Thu, May 15, 2008 - 8:17 AM
        "" And for Christian's practicing paganism, though they don't like being told :-) ""

        Oh, gosh, I don't mind. Just part of the mystical milkshake.
        • Re: Syncretic worship

          Thu, May 15, 2008 - 9:02 AM
          Actually, that was a gross generalisation... I know plenty of christians more than happy to recognise the pagan origins of their religious practice... it was unfair of me

          <bad dobby>
  • Re: Syncretic worship

    Fri, May 16, 2008 - 2:32 AM
    "While I would say that my patron is St Kessog and that I also work with other saints, my shine is dedicated primarily to Cernunnos. When I first came across him, I was apprehensive. I was from a Christian background and found it difficult to get past the Lucifer image, but two events changed my mind..."

    Donald McKinney writing about working with Gods and spirits in Walking th Mist

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