rehearsal etiquette

topic posted Wed, November 19, 2008 - 8:24 AM by  offlineNadia
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So, I've talked before in here about the Portland Youth Philharmonic. The last few years, their groups have seriously kicked some ass and weren't sounding like youth Ensembles. But this year... between getting a new conductor that's not worth his salt, and whatever else... the rehearsal etiquette is dispcable. Enough that we're playing about half as much music as we should be, and still sounding... well, like a Youth Orchestra. Im not sure what's up, if people just need to be nudged and reminded, or if everyone's just apathetic, or... what.

All I know is it's not being worth the two nights a week, loss of sleep and extra money that I have to spend to be able to participate in the two groups I'm in. Maybe it'll get better after the winter concerts, but I'm not having alot of faith. I really wanna quit; there's other ensembles around that would accept me, one of which would put me closer to having my degree but is conflicting with PY wind ensembles' time.

So... my conflict is that I feel that I promised to play with them until June, but it's not being worth it. There's other options that wouldn't tear my life up as much and I would actually be learning something. But my private horn instructor is the conductor... how do I drop his ensembles without offending him, even though I think it's his fault that there's a rehearsal etiquette problem?

Any suggestions? thoughts? I'm not looking for full answers, but input is nice...

thanks,

nadia
posted by:
Nadia
Portland
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  • Re: rehearsal etiquette

    Wed, November 19, 2008 - 9:10 AM
    You get private lessons from him… discuss it with him. Don't attack and make it sound like "you're letting things get screwed up…" but let him know that in your eyes, there's a problem with it.

    I figure one of two things is likely (and since I know nothing about him, I can't tell you which)… either he'll hear that you want to leave and try to change things within PY to try to keep you, or he'll be a jerk and let you quit and stop giving you private lessons to boot.

    Either way, honestly, you're closer to what you want to get out of it.
    • Re: rehearsal etiquette

      Wed, November 19, 2008 - 3:08 PM
      the problem with this is that last year, I did mention it... I intoned that I felt if things weren't fixed then, they wouldn't get fixed... that it'd be too late in a year... and guess what...

      He's usually pretty cool. Buddhist pacifist type... and I'm not particularily willing to go to his house to take lessons-- it's a 2 hour bus ride out of my way. Right now, I'm taking lessons from him before rehearsal...
      • Re: rehearsal etiquette

        Thu, November 20, 2008 - 9:18 AM
        It seems to me like you've already done what you can to keep yourself in that environment. So… I think you shouldn't feel obligated to stay somewhere that isn't working for you. It is still about you, and not really about the orchestra.

        If you're still not sure what to do, you could always start a conversation with some of the people who, to you, appear to be affected by the problems and not part of the problem. It could be you're one of many and don't know it. If a bunch of people express a desire to leave, maybe more attention would be paid to fixing what's going on. Or… if it's just you, then maybe it really IS time to leave.

        I hope I'm helping…
  • Re: rehearsal etiquette

    Wed, February 11, 2009 - 7:00 PM
    If you said you'd do it, you are committed. But take him aside, and tell him that the rehearsal ettiquette is driving you bananas. Once committed to a gig, never back out, unless there is a damn good reason. Not being happy with the quality, or the repertoire, or how rehearsals are conducted is not a damn good reason. A heart attack,or a major catastrophe is. SO many times I have been in an orginization that people have backed out of, when they we being counted on. It is not fair to the people who are putting forth their best effort.
    • Re: rehearsal etiquette

      Wed, February 11, 2009 - 7:18 PM
      "If you're still not sure what to do, you could always start a conversation with some of the people who, to you, appear to be affected by the problems and not part of the problem. It could be you're one of many and don't know it. If a bunch of people express a desire to leave, maybe more attention would be paid to fixing what's going on. "

      We had a very similiar situation in the Chesapeake Concert Band a year or so ago. That band consists of (mostly) retired educators, although there are a few young people playing in it, and a few of us who are just accomplished musicians but not making a living from it.. The youngest member is an alto sax player who is a senior in high school. The oldest is a bass clarinet player, who is 96. The band was playing the same music over and over, and making the same mistakes in all respects, including bad notes. Finally, in desperation, four of us got together over coffee - outside of the rehearsal environment, and talked about what was wrong and how to fix it. We then went to the conductor, and presented our suggestions to him. At the next rehearsal, he asked that one of us be a spoksperson for the group, and tell the entire band, without naming specific individuals, just what the problems were. Since then, we have become one of the best concert bands in the Baltimore area. Oh, we are not as good as the First Army Field Band, or the Washington DC Navy or Marine Corps Band, but we aren't being paid thirty to sixty grand a year, either.We are the only civilian band to play at Fort McHenry National Monument, though, so I think that says something about the quality of musicianship. We achieved that because everyone just needed a "wake-up" call.
    • Re: rehearsal etiquette

      Wed, February 11, 2009 - 10:56 PM
      yeah... i'm following through on the commitement. sometimes it's better then others.

      as a new years resolution he decided to put his foot down; it's not like he had been... blind. just a pacifiest. so twice he's really chewed everyone out, and is calling people on talking.... so in some ways it's better

      but this evening... no one was paying attention. johnson was sick... just sucked... he let us go 5 minutes early in exasperation instead of imploring us to pay attention... very frusterating. if nothing else, 4 more months. but i was planning on doing this another 3 years, and i dont know where else i can play in SE portland.
      • Re: rehearsal etiquette

        Mon, February 16, 2009 - 2:44 PM
        That's the problem with performances. (and rehearsals) Most of the time thye are just blah - uninspiring, at best - That's why they call it work. But once a year or so, there is a synergy that occurs. The whole becomes greater than the sum of its parts. Everyone is "on" and hears and FEELS everyone else, and there is nothing like it in the whole world. I think that is why we all stay in this crazy game.Because it just feels so good when you know that you (as a group - not individually, but that, too) realy nailed it. It is best when that happens with an audience, but sometimes it happens in rehearsal or in the studioi, and it still feels damn good. A lot of musicians I know, say thaey dislike studio work, but I still get a kick out of it when it all comes together.
        • Re: rehearsal etiquette

          Tue, February 17, 2009 - 4:01 PM
          we used to get that feeling... twice a month, maybe even once a rehearsal, when everyone was present, mentally. it's not magic, even though that's the effect. It's a matter of people being PRESENT, in the moment, not stressing about the rest of their lives. It just takes EVERYONE to put in that extra 15% to create sparks. it's not random.
          • Re: rehearsal etiquette

            Thu, April 23, 2009 - 10:41 PM
            How are things going? Have they improved much/at all?

            Youth orchestra can be great... or it can suck. So much depends on leadership (like so much else in life).

            The best youth orchestra I've ever seen was the Empire State Youth Orchestra when Eiji Oue was conducting... this was a bunch of years ago, before he went on to a moderately distinguished conducting career. Maybe that's the difference... he was a young, hip conductor on his way up; sounds like your guy isn't particularly dynamic. Or inspiring.
            • Re: rehearsal etiquette

              Fri, April 24, 2009 - 12:43 AM
              "Youth orchestra can be great... or it can suck. So much depends on leadership (like so much else in life). "

              That goes double for community theater. We had a dress rehearsal last night for Guys and Dolls. The only full section oof the pit orchestra that showed up and remained for the entire rehearsal was the Reed section. I was both mortified and astounded at that. I have never before been in a pit orchestra anywhere that everyone was not present for the last rehearsal before the show. If I were the conductor, I would fire all those who did not show, and get replacements, even if I had to go to the show director and ask for money to pay them. There was one person who left early, but she can be forgiven; she showed up for the rehearsal, even though she was clearly not well. She stayed through the first act, but finally had to give up, and left before the second act started. She is also an excellent musician, and probably did not need the rehearsal nearly as much as the rehearsal needed her. That is also true of the entire reed section. We have all played this show, on the books we are playing for this production, many times. This is my eleventh production (eighth on the Reed III book) of the show, but each of the others in the reed section have played it at least three times, and two of the players have conducted the show twice each. Bu only one trumpet player stayed for the entire rehearsal, as did the pianist, bassist, and drummer. None of the other string players have been present for more than one rehearsal, and none appeared at the dress rehearsal. the trombone player made one rehearsal, and only was there for the first act of the dress rehearsal, as was the second trumpet player. He has not made any others of the rehearsals. It really was sad, and their playing reflected their lack of rehearsal time. Because of them, and the missing parts, the entire orchestra sounded bad for most of the show, except where there were reed soli passages. By the end of the rehearsal, the conductor was obviously very angry, and frustrated, and I can't say that I blame her. I just hope we get through opening night tomorrow without any train wrecks.

            • Re: rehearsal etiquette

              Fri, April 24, 2009 - 7:11 AM
              they....are better.

              about 3 weeks ago, the horns were... pathetic. and that's coming from a horn player. they were joking and laughing so much they could not make entrances; i was the only one playing, so mortefied and terrefied you could hardly hear me. he finally rounded on that part of the section, said that if he caught them talking again he would fire every horn and have his friends come in. would be very happy to play mahlers' rondo from the 7th symphony.... lol. yeah.

              so they really shut up. i kind of talked to them the next day, for orchestra rehearsal (that was during wind ensemble).... apparently they had both received about 20 talks about in the course of 24 hours, and were about to burst into tears. they also paid attention in theory class, and have sense. deffinate improvement....

              but that doesn't mean i'm riling to make the commitment for next year, as much i very much want to. i dont know anyone else who is as gutsy as johnson, and plays as difficult or intricate music for the wind ensemble. on his note... johnson.... he's very funny. he's great individually; i love him as a private horn teacher. but he doesn't know how to do the mass ensemble pep talks.

              so yeah... things are better. at least for this year. i'm terrefied for next year though.
              • Re: rehearsal etiquette

                Fri, April 24, 2009 - 11:31 AM
                I had the good fortune (or mis-fortune, depending on how you look at it) to have been taught from age four through my four years in the Navy by people who were perfectionists. That reinforced my love of music, and instilled in me the drive for perfectionism in performance. Consequently, I cannot understand those who do not care as much as I about the quality of performance, or the quality of their own playing during rehearsal. I am only human; of course I have days when I am not "on", and I have days whgen dragging myself to another performance or rehearsal is the last thing I want to do. BUT, once I am seated in the chair, I give playing my undivided attention, and always put forth my best effort, and can't understand or abide those who do not.
              • Re: rehearsal etiquette

                Sat, April 25, 2009 - 4:57 PM
                Well, at least it's least it won't be a source of daily anxiety... so that's a good thing. And who knows what might happen by next year? :)

                On a lighter note, my favorite orchestra joke:

                Q: What's the difference been an orchestra and a bull?

                A: With the bull, you have the horns at the front and the asshole at the rear, while with the orchestra....

                :)
                • Re: rehearsal etiquette

                  Sat, April 25, 2009 - 9:52 PM
                  lol. mind if i post that on facebook?
                  • This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.

                    Re: rehearsal etiquette

                    Sun, April 26, 2009 - 7:47 PM
                    Well - dress rehearsal for Guys and Dolls was an absolute shambles, but opening night was very good. Saturday's show was merely fair, and today's matinee was superb. We had a guest conductor and were missing all the strings and the trombone today for the matinee show. Pit consisted of flute and oboe covering violin I and II, four saxes, doubling on clarinet (with the fourth sax on bass clarinet), one trumpet, a keyboard player covering the missing viola, cello and trombone parts, piano, bass and drums. Because we were so small, we were able to get a good blend, and the guest conductor had better tempos, so where it was supposed to, the book swung like mad. It was a real kick, playing with such a good bunch of musicians. We were all on, and everyone was afraid of messing up in front of the rest of the musicians, so we sounded really good.
                    • Re: rehearsal etiquette

                      Thu, April 30, 2009 - 9:39 AM
                      Holy shit!

                      That sounds like a recipe for disaster... and yet you managed to pull it off? Good work!

                      Just goes to show... when you get a bunch of folks together who know what they're doing and are able to roll with whatever comes at them, you can make magic... :)
                      • Re: rehearsal etiquette

                        Thu, April 30, 2009 - 6:14 PM
                        It really is a kick, working with an all professional group for a change. We all knew what we were doing, and we all knew what was expected of us. It was good.

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