Define the perfect Pennsic Party

topic posted Sat, August 18, 2007 - 5:26 PM by  David
So, I was wondering. What is it that makes a party at Pennsic special for you? Is it the decor? The music? Dancing? Drink? Performances? Theme? Company?.... OK, you get the idea.

I've been to 5 Pennsics, and MANY parties over the course of those years (I typically hit several a night, and I go out just about every night - rain or not). I also, as you may have guessed, am heavily involved in the planning of the Three Skulls' party. Inquiring minds want to know what you like seeing when you go out (not at any one party - in general).

Also, anything that just really bothers you about parties in general would be nice to get out in the open. I think this can prove a good way to improve the nightlife at Pennsic in years to come (not that it's bad, but improvement is, by its nature, a good thing). Any thoughts are welcome and sought after. Thanks in advance for your input.

~David of House Three Skulls
posted by:
David
New York
  • Re: Define the perfect Pennsic Party

    Sat, August 18, 2007 - 5:41 PM
    Good: Places to sit.

    Bad: Dense crowds.
    Long (10 minutes is long) performances unless they're the stated point of the party.
    • Re: Define the perfect Pennsic Party

      Sat, August 18, 2007 - 5:48 PM
      I'm inclined to agree on the sitting bit.

      In regards to the performances bit, though - I know several parties this year had fire performance. In some cases, this was spread out throughout the evening, and each spurt was maybe 10-15 minutes. Is this in the "bad" category, or still on the acceptable side? Particularly if it doesn't stop the party from happening around it.
      • Re: Define the perfect Pennsic Party

        Sat, August 18, 2007 - 5:57 PM
        That wouldn't be so bad. It's more tied into the dense crowds thing. So if you've got something that needs a *lot* of space and it's going to make everything really crowded, it would be nice if it was shorter. Although, I guess 15 minutes isn't really that bad, it occurs to me that at the one party I was thinking of they had like 3 different 15 minute things in a row.

        The crowds are also an issue because they make it hard to even sit on the ground.

        Another thing, and this isn't something people running parties can really control, but I wish more people were willing to talk to strangers at parties. Too many of the parties felt like people going to a bar instead of parties. Hard to explain. Not saying that people have to always bring others into their circles or whatever, but more openness would've been nice.
        • Re: Define the perfect Pennsic Party

          Sat, August 18, 2007 - 6:03 PM
          I completely understand what you mean in terms of the crowds.

          When we have our party, we make sure we leave sufficient room for people to move around not only the performances, but the fire, the drummers, and the dancers as well as get over to the bar.

          As far as the openness, a lot does depend on the type of party. Personally, I'm an open-minded loudmouth (particularly at our own party), so I don't usually run into that issue much, but I can completely see where others might.

          ~David
        • Re: Define the perfect Pennsic Party

          Sun, August 19, 2007 - 9:46 AM
          Being a first-timer at Pennsic, and coming late during War week to boot, I had the good fortune to be made welcome at a number of parties and people were more than willing to engage me in conversation. Granted, that was probably aided by my own willingness to strike up conversations with complete strangers - how else am I ever going to meet people? But still, I found a number of welcoming folks around Pennsic fires and bars... and am grateful for it.

          That said, allow me to echo the comment about seating. I was also limping during my entire time at War, due to a torn meniscus ( I think - my upcoming MRI will tell for sure), and being able to sit down while socializing was a real plus. So it's definitely a necessity to make sure that the amount of seating available corresponds to the crowd one is expecting, such that those who really want or need to sit will be able to do so.
          • Re: Define the perfect Pennsic Party

            Sun, August 19, 2007 - 9:58 AM
            There are so many things that make a great party and it will be different things to different people. I have had great times at the very large parties and also great times at the smaller parties. You can never really tell what will make things click. I think most of it has to do with attitude, not just the attitude of the hosts, but more importantly the attitude of the attendees. There have been great times at small ad hoc gatherings of folks that just sort of met at a place in Pennsic and decided to have a real good time and there have been those massive parties that just fell short because the people there decided to act poorly (fortunately I didn't witness any of those this year).
            Some big parties are very well planned and due to that hard work, they are very successful, but at a real burden to the hosts (Pentwyvern and Fledermaus are examples of these types). And we were at a very small gathering at Nightshade that was a whole lot of fun, but very low impact on the camp. Who knows what makes things work? But a lot of them just do.
    • Re: Define the perfect Pennsic Party

      Sun, August 19, 2007 - 1:41 AM
      We had a few performances this year. I specifically broke it up into bite-sized chunks for just that reason. I have been performing for many years, and I know what the Pennsic attention span is. :) I hope my evenings of fire at Vlad's weren't too long for people!
      • Re: Define the perfect Pennsic Party

        Sun, August 19, 2007 - 2:01 AM
        Personally, I enjoyed them. I was pretty biased, as we were there to see Hilary perform (her being part of our Household, and all), but I think it was broken up pretty well.

        Also, the ability to have more going on at the same time worked out pretty well - the party didn't stop dead for the non-pyrophiliacs out there.

        One suggestion if you guys look to do it again next year - you may want to give a little more distance for the longer-range stuff (like the fire dart). A couple of the people up front seemed a little spooked at times. I've done safety for my Lady many times (unfortunately, she didn't spin this year), so it doesn't bother me as much, but I could feel the heat pretty close, and I don't think a lot of people realize just how close they are to the flames sometimes.
  • Re: Define the perfect Pennsic Party

    Sat, August 18, 2007 - 6:18 PM
    Places to sit.

    LOTS of people (small parties are fine if you know the people or don't want anything too crazy. I like both, and this post is about crazy).

    A good bar (good only has to include a variety of alcohols and non-alky beverages to mix drinks with, and perhaps a standard beer selection to choose from (tap or not, irrelevent)).

    Music (the kind people can participate in, not just sit and listen to (the latter being more suitable for smaller parties)).

    -Good- IDing (I've been a supporter of this even before I could drink, just because it's stupid to get other people in trouble just to illegally drink at -their- locale).

    Most importantly, a basic party theme (this is particularly if you want to stand out and attract attention. The 'theme' concept can become too exclusionary if the idea is centered on attracting/allowing only a particular persona/crowd to participate/enter, so it should be more of a general idea/thrust than a strict rule if you're aiming for a big party. Otherwise, have fun).

    ~ Kole
  • Re: Define the perfect Pennsic Party

    Sat, August 18, 2007 - 6:29 PM
    Good: performers - fire breather, spinner, etc...
    Good: water for performers/drummers/etc...
    Good: seats reserved for musicians of all varieties (melody and drum) - not all of us want to lug a chair everywhere we go and not all of us can play standing up
    Good: melody musicians

    Bad: hard to hear if anyone is talking (i.e. stage) during/for a performance unless you're next to the 'stage'
    Very Bad: disorganized drumming, lack of leadership

    True Story: last year (PW 35), I went to a party and as I approached, it sounded like a cacophony of drumming going on. As I got closer to the fire, I saw that there was an almost complete circle of drummers, so I started walking around to see where I could sit and drum. What I realized, as I was walking around, was that the two sides of the fire were playing TWO TOTALLY DIFFERENT RHYTHMS!!!! I continued to walk around the fire as I made my way out of the party.
    • Re: Define the perfect Pennsic Party

      Sat, August 18, 2007 - 8:42 PM
      <<True Story: last year (PW 35), I went to a party and as I approached, it sounded like a cacophony of drumming going on. As I got closer to the fire, I saw that there was an almost complete circle of drummers, so I started walking around to see where I could sit and drum. What I realized, as I was walking around, was that the two sides of the fire were playing TWO TOTALLY DIFFERENT RHYTHMS!!!! I continued to walk around the fire as I made my way out of the party.>>



      I've been in the middle of one of those and it's a good thing I'm a multi-tasking. Dancing to it was crazy. I held on for a while but eventually said screw it and left the circle.



      Good for parties... space to move, WATER, good set-up for dancers and musicians...
    • Re: Define the perfect Pennsic Party

      Mon, August 20, 2007 - 10:18 PM
      Totally happened this year too...at a big party which shall remain nameless...

      As a dancer, I find it more frustrating. We can't turn your music into a visual if we can't find your rhythm. Find a beat as a group and stick with it. But this also requires a talented drummer to take the lead....so that goes back to your VERY bad point

      Long story short...I agree completely! Lol
  • Re: Define the perfect Pennsic Party

    Sun, August 19, 2007 - 7:03 AM
    As a fellow party hoster and goer, I have mixed feelings.

    Space at Pennsic is a premium thing that you'll only find at Royal encampments. Really... Unless the Land 0 Crats figure out and offer extra space for big party throwing camps, you're going to be squished no matter where you go.

    When we threw Hell Nite we'd have some 3,000 + people show up during the party. Our camp space didn't really allow for us to have 3,000 people standing or sitting... but we managed. We'd squeeze all of our tents as much as possible and position things about the open space to sort of have a flow (Feng Shui?) of traffic. The bar in one spot, fire centrally located, whip chicks up on the hill, games scattered throughout. It seemed to work pretty well. Though the lines getting in (pending on when you got there) could get out of hand and really long, we always did our best to keep people entertained. The entire party could be seen via the road, so all those waiting to get in had a bird's eye view at least.

    This year, we had more people in camp, and less space. Hell Nite just wouldn't work. We also tried moving the party area closer to the water, and in a period ONLY ring of tents. We thought we'd attempt to make our party area more "in The Dream". We used the hill as an amphitheater with the entertainment at the bottom. Because of the limited space we had "invite only" which was really just bring a bottle of wine and costume. Yeah, some actual invites were given out, but only to those folks who helped us in the past with our parties (running security, whip chicks, bar maids, etc) and then to anyone who asked for one.

    In all, I think the size and flow of the Bacchanalia worked very well. Almost everyone had a costume (which made it a great photo op) and there was a ton of wine to be drunk (along with beers, meads, cider, etc).

    I even had my living room of my tent opened so that folks could come and sit, drink, eat, and watch the party from a "front row" style seat. We had many visitors (thanks to all that did stop by!) and I had a blast (So did Azhrde, even though she wasn't feeling well). We welcomed anyone who wanted to stop in and sit. As did (I believe) one of our other pavilion tent owners in her living room.

    But, finding seating for 500 or 1,000 people is virtually impossible. Even if we mass created bench seats for that many, we'd have to use a Uhaul to bring them all (also not very feasible). Seating at a party, any party, is always a premium. Honestly, it might be best to bring your own folding chair if seating is needed (or request ahead of time to have one saved for you).

    Oh, one last thing, yes, we do try to provide seating for drummers/musicians, as we had our camp's folding chairs at the back of the performance area. Whether or not they used them, I"m not sure.
    • Re: Define the perfect Pennsic Party

      Sun, August 19, 2007 - 6:24 PM
      <<<<But, finding seating for 500 or 1,000 people is virtually impossible. Even if we mass created bench seats for that many, we'd have to use a Uhaul to bring them all (also not very feasible). Seating at a party, any party, is always a premium. Honestly, it might be best to bring your own folding chair if seating is needed (or request ahead of time to have one saved for you). >>>>

      I don't think you need to provide seating for everyone. One of the things I love about Vlad's is that I can sit on the side of the road and still feel like I'm not missing too much. I just hate when I have to go 50 feet away from the party to find an empty place to sit which puts me in an empty ditch, in the dark, by myself. But there are some parties (like hell night for example) where I know there are just going to be too many people to ever find a space large enough to sit without getting trampled.
      • Re: Define the perfect Pennsic Party

        Sun, August 19, 2007 - 6:49 PM
        fire... good primal back beat... cold drinks... friends... stories and song... huggs : )

        (and for me some nakkidness is always a nice touch)
        • Re: Define the perfect Pennsic Party

          Sun, August 19, 2007 - 6:54 PM
          You're typically most of the way there. I imagine if you ask nicely, we can get someone to run by and quickly remove you of your loincloth next year.

          Somehow, I don't think that's where you were going with that, but you never know.
          • Re: Define the perfect Pennsic Party

            Sun, August 19, 2007 - 8:34 PM
            i was more thinking of other people dressing as i do... : )

            ...it was the best of garb for this pennsic....
            • Re: Define the perfect Pennsic Party

              Sun, August 19, 2007 - 8:49 PM
              I'm a little too modest for the lack of pant legs, but I tend to go without a shirt for most of war (with the exception of battles, where it's a little more required). Especially with the wet weather (which you grow used to over the years), it works out pretty well. Once you get used to the temperature without the shirt, you're in much better shape - particularly when trying to dry out after a deluge.

              Of course, I doubt the Ladies of Pennsic would start wandering around similarly, but I'm sure there are some who would not mind.
            • Re: Define the perfect Pennsic Party

              Tue, August 28, 2007 - 10:58 AM
              D'ner, I hereby pledge to include at least one loincloth in my garb for next war, AND to be in good enough shape to wear it and not scare small children. You are absolutely right about it being the best garb for this particular war.
  • Re: Define the perfect Pennsic Party

    Sun, August 19, 2007 - 10:02 AM
    At Pennsic there are really only two REQUIRED elements for a party - Alcohol & Light. Like moths scadians are drawn to these things. When one or the other is out, so is the party. OPTIONALLY to make a better party I want:

    1. Intimacy, in other words, you don't have to shout to talk, you can meet a stranger or friend and converse, and can catch a show (poi, sung, spoken, whatever). You aren't jostled by everyone trying to reach the bar. But the bar might be packed, it's just that there is a zone where you can get slightly away.

    2. Water. It's easier to drink copious quanitities of alcohol, dance and play like a fiend, and even talk, if you aren't dehydrated. Further, water makes it possible for you to be functional the next day, when you may wish to fight, or go to classes or something. It's easier to carry around a bottle of Captain's Private Stock or other inebriant than it is to carry enough water to wash it down. (Grog after all was water and rum.)

    3. Seating, sit down to talk, to drum, to just drink and watch. Also to show how "chivalrous" you are to an attractive prospect "give" your seat to them. Nothing says I "care" like a dry chair at War. I spend allot of time sitting on the Ravenspittle. After walking from top side it's a huge relief. Eschew Walmartesque "camp chairs" they are flimsey, take up a ton of space, and totally blow any "period feel. A bunch of benches are great and they can be stored away easily...also they encourage people to cozy up.

    4. Plausible Deniability to time & place. While folks are sitting, drinking, flirting, and watching they should be able to forget the time, year, or century. I LOVE being in Casa Bardicci, parts of Vlad's or other camps where I can scan about and because of the mix of garb, alcohol, and decor I can "deny" the 21st century even if it's only for a few moments. Those moments are MAGIC, and Pennsic is a venue that sometimes makes them possible. There is another aspect of plausible deniability that is more sinister....

    5. Plausible Deniability in mundania. The proliferation of cellphones and cameras at war is a mixed blessing and curse. Magical moments at night can turn into nothing less than personal tragedies because some ass with a camera is taking pictures and posting them to the internet when they should simply be in the moment capturing the passage of events in memory. During the day, capture all the photos you want, at night put the damn phones and cameras away and just have fun. I'd love to go to a party with a prominent "NO TECHNOLOGY" sign on the door, and a policy of kicking-out shutter bugs. I've seen this in action at some parties and it works to a point, some idiot always manages to get a shot or two off before he's caught. Certainly 10-15 years ago there were more "spontaneous" moments simply because people didn't fear some quick handed paparazzi turning the moment into an eternity.

    In my opinion, if you were to provide the two required and five optional elements, you really don't have to worry about the theme, performers, music, or company. They will all come and be as varied and wonderful as you might imagine. Maybe I'm naive, but I think good people will rapidly gravitate to a known "safe zone" at War. As they seem to do.

    Dragan
    What we fear comes to pass more speedily than what we hope."
    - Publilius Syrus - Moral Sayings (1st C B.C.)
    • Re: Define the perfect Pennsic Party

      Sun, August 19, 2007 - 10:21 AM
      I have to second all of these points here, as several of them are the principals upon which we focus our party plans. It appears that other camps are doing the same (not because of us, but I think everyone's having the same ideas), which is great.

      In regards to intimacy, we try to keep the bar on one end of the camp and the fire/drumming/dancing towards the center, with our commons tent on the other end. In this way, we're able to keep a quieter end of the camp away from the bar press and not on top of the drumming.

      Water is a huge plus. We keep two coolers stocked, plus jugs for the dancers and drummers (so they don't have to stop unless they want to). Knowing several of the dancers and drummers cause, well, they live with us has made this a much stronger point.

      Seating is always awesome. We have 4 or 5 benches we use for the camp that are specifically for the party, and we're talking about more that are easier to break down/store so we can provide more seating down the road.

      Plausible deniability to time/place - we do what we can, having all period tents around/in the common area (except for the common pavilion, which isn't exactly the easiest thing to replace), but there's a lot of camps (Bardicci for one) that do a fantastic job of this. I don't think that degree is strictly necessary for me, but when it's there, it's awesome.

      As to the camera thing, I completely agree. We thought about the sign, but the rain washed that out due to more pressing issues, and ended up almost ejecting a couple of people from the party due to photos being taken. Someone else wasn't allowed in due to photo issues earlier in the war involving members of our household. But I think the people in our camp should have some measure of confidence that, even if what they do is not strictly private, it's not going to be plastered across the web for all to see.

      Overall, I think you hit on a lot of the points I tend to lean towards personally when I go wandering and half-past-dark.
      • Re: Define the perfect Pennsic Party

        Sun, August 19, 2007 - 10:41 AM
        David speaks true. Three Skulls is one of the camps that's been very good about making parties more than just occasions to drink. I've had a really good time in Three Skulls and hope to spend more time there in years to come. You've featured some really great performances. I recall last year striking up conversations and generally having a great time in your camp at least one night. Thank you!

        I didn't manage to make it there this year as I was hobbling around on an injured foot and it was raining, I was picturing your camp on it's hillside, being dangerous ground for me to navigate. ;-)

        Hopefully this thread will drum up interest in other camps to make more "party zones" throughout the week. IMO more party zones would be the best way to alleviate the mega-party syndrome that has been the second week paradigm . With more places to go, people might spread out more, rather than clumping into huge thirsty crowds. Reduced crowds = more intimacy.

        Dragan
        • Re: Define the perfect Pennsic Party

          Sun, August 19, 2007 - 10:58 AM
          Funny you mention that. The reason we do our party on Tuesday is because that's typically the biggest war-week party night, and we don't want a crowd that borders on dangerous. As you've probably seen, we get a good amount of people in there anyway, but if not for competing parties and/or rain keeping people away, we'd have to turn people away at the door. As it was this year, despite the rain, we had delays at the gate a couple of times because other parties canceled.

          We had to do a lot to prep the camp because of all the water - there was a lot of trenching earlier in the day, and about 200 pounds of sand in order to control a lot of the mud because of the ground saturation, especially in the dug up areas (like around the fire pit). The camp was pretty safe most of the night, but I can understand not risking it with an injury.

          I'd like to see more parties and the wealth spread out a little bit. There were a couple of nights this war (Wednesday and Friday come to mind particularly) where things seems almost too quiet. The big parties were too big, a lot of people canceled due to rain and, while I had a good time, I was disappointed by the vibe a couple of nights. Luckily, I managed to stumble across a couple of goings-on late in the evening on Friday, which really perked me up, but Wednesday in particular was a bit of a let-down in terms of distribution of people.
    • Re: Define the perfect Pennsic Party

      Wed, August 22, 2007 - 12:18 AM
      To here all of these remarks, from my brother/stunt husband/friend........
      This is why I camp with this man. I lend my services to him as a generic merc.

      As the Dragan is strong, yet, blond, he is also wise

      Pay me a lot of money, and I'll let you know all the secrets that I know! (Kidding)

      Actually, he does speak the truth about parties at war.
    • Re: Define the perfect Pennsic Party

      Thu, August 30, 2007 - 1:11 PM
      In my opinion, I think that the two requirements to get people to your party are lots of drums and dancers. I think it was the first or second night of Pennsic when my friends and I went to Vlads to see only about 15-20 people there. I took my djembe and had a friend of mine take my doumbek. I immediatly told them where I was going to post up for the night to play. Granted this was around 10:00-10:30 when we arrived. After we started playing, within a half hour or so there were many musicians as well as dancers and I would say around 100-200 people there. Not saying that it was us, but when I walk around I listen for the drums. ;-)

      Raif
      • Re: Define the perfect Pennsic Party

        Fri, August 31, 2007 - 8:01 AM
        Some oflks simply do NOT lcare for the drumming though. For them you've shown how to NOT throw the perfect party.

        I truly look forward to someday making to Vlads to see how they balance that out for folks who do and do not care for the drumming and dancing.

        A mundane comparison. Go to a wedding or a party where there is a band or a DJ. It doesn't matter. which. I'm invariably seated nearest the Speakers OR the volume is "tested" so that EVERYONE can hear the music, even at the back of the room. That is a mistake. I don't go to events like that to have my head pounded out and to have my ears bleeding. FOr me and amny i knwo the same goes for Pennsic. We don't go to parties to have the drummers try to perform for EVERYONE at Pennsic from where they are seated. That being the case then they are definitely trying to be too loud to make up for a lack of talent.

        This of course is only my opinion as well. Since every has them. Take it or leave it. Give me something to do and people to meet rather than sit and drool on the dancers and listen to drummers that are too loud. I believe that some camps do that?
  • Re: Define the perfect Pennsic Party

    Sun, August 19, 2007 - 2:41 PM
    One of my favorite nights at war was when my camp was invaded by a bunch of drummers. The heads of our camp has just gotten married so the entire camp was in this state of mess and who-the-hell-cares attitude toward throwing a party. With the arrival of a bunch of amazing drummers, we had a party and one of the best ones i can remember.
    The best thing about it is that all we had to do was offer light and water. We didn't serve a drop of alcohol.
    I don't think there's a perfect mixture for a perfect party. It's got to be the mood of the people who come. That night the mood was set by some drummers going "hell yeah!" and then other people showed up going "hell yeah!" and so it was a hell yeah kind of night.

    I also like ending my nights at vlad's. It's totally the diner of pennsic. At the point where the other parties die, you can wander to vlad's and only the people who are die hard interested in being social are left.

    I love hitting up the later hours of bardicci parties. with the atmosphere.

    Men with out pants will always be a favorite... It's totally got a bit of a sausage fest thing going for it (I'm a girl, I have NO qualms with that... but ladies, really you should check it out) It's also got an invasion of awesome blue people every year. It's also the largest adult-style party I get the chance to see or go to.
    • Re: Define the perfect Pennsic Party

      Wed, August 22, 2007 - 10:40 AM
      It's unfortunate but I never have a good time at MWOP. This is the 4th time I've gone and the 4th time that I felt overwhelemed by the amount of people who a) don't want to talk, b) can't hear you because it's too loud, c) think that because the men are walking around without pants that it's a grab for all for whoever comes in regardless of gender, or d) use the anonymity of woad to disguse rude and unchivalrous behavior.

      Trust me - I'd love to go to MWOP and have a good time! I had a good time my first year there. Since then though? It's too much like a frat party and too little like the beautiful glow of a good Pennsic party.

      What I did enjoy was wandering with the pirates, the parties at the alehouse, wandering with whatever amoeba happens by, Howling Mouse and Hedgehog parties and the smaller, more social and not drunken free-for-all type parties. I'll wander all night to find an inviting campfire - most of war week though, I never found one. The energy was off all of War week - it was seriously confusing.
  • Re: Define the perfect Pennsic Party

    Mon, August 20, 2007 - 8:02 AM
    Elspeth said:
    <Another thing, and this isn't something people running parties can really control, but I wish more people were willing to talk to strangers at parties. Too many of the parties felt like people going to a bar instead of parties. Hard to explain. Not saying that people have to always bring others into their circles or whatever, but more openness would've been nice. >

    I kind of have to second that. This was my first Pennsic and I had a blast, but I was definitely pushing my comfort limits in being outgoing to meet people. I was there with an old friend who is a regular Pennsic-goer. She is very reserved. I realized pretty quickly that unless we started talking to people, it would be just the two of us standing there talking to each other. So I just started making random comments (not rude, but like "love that dress!", "oohhh, shiny!", etc.) about people walking by until someone responded back, a conversation started, we got included in the party amoeba and off we went. This is not ~normal~ behavior for me, trust me. However, it served the purpose. Later in the week, we went out with some people from home who know me fairly well and they were shocked at my behavior! It was their first Pennsic, too but we had the best time and met wonderful people (most of whose names I can't remember, sorry!). One of the reasons I felt I could do that was the anonymity of the whole thing. Like I'll ever see (or recognize) the yummy almost naked guy at MWOPs again (although he did taste good!).

    On a different note, I second the water thing. I'm a big water drinker and try to avoid hangovers by mixing my water with my alcohol. I think clearly