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I have a thing I want to make out of plastic. I've never worked with plastics before, have gone to Taps and chatted with their staff -- Taps staff are incredibly friendly/helpful, btw, every time I've been there -- and I have some vague idea of how to do this, eventually, after much mussing around learning to work with these materials.
(The thing I want to make is a larger 3-D version of one of the creatures drawn by Haeckel: caliban.mpiz-koeln.mpg.de/~stue...arien/ and en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imag...hoidea.jpg , haven't settled on one yet. I'm in no hurry and I figure something this complex will be take many months to get going and completed, especially knowing the very little I know right now.)
Anyway, my question to y'all: Is there anyone here who has worked with plastics before and wouldn't mind me poking with questions as they come up?
Thanks!
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Re: plastics anyone?
Fri, November 3, 2006 - 6:00 AMI love Erneast Haeckel in fact the lower middle on I have been toying with making for years. I was going to use recycled knife blades from thrift stores.
Here’s what I know about plastic.
In sheet form
Plexiglass in a sheet can be cut and routed with a CNC. It can be slumped with a large flat heat source. It is not glued it is chemically bonded.
Here is the glue name
Weld-on
Place #3 in joint and let dry then fill in the seams with #16
www.rplastics.com/plac.html
In a scuptural form the only thing I know is this stuff but I have had people tell me it doesn’t work very well.
shapelock.com/
In a liquid you can cast for you can use Enrirotech casting resin.
www.djhobby.com/cgi-bin/indexpage.pl
I think I might need to know more about your process to understand what your material needs are.
Depending on what you are trying to do you might be able to use a another material and then coat it with plastic.
Good luck,
Janine
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Re: plastics anyone?
Fri, November 3, 2006 - 8:13 AMjanine should have her own show called
" This ole art"
I might also mention I use a great place called
Douglass and Sturges sculpture supplies
www.artstuf.com
these guys are some of the best, drop them a note.
oxoxo
fucko -
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Re: plastics anyone?
Fri, November 3, 2006 - 8:26 AM"This ole art" = This old art show.....
More like "this old fart" show
You know why I love you.... It's because you type about as well as I do.
Sucks being dyslextic
Thanks for the new link......
Janine
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Re: plastics anyone?
Fri, November 3, 2006 - 10:07 AMReally complex shapes like that are tough - my first thought it so make them out of clay, then do a mold and make copies out of resin. Tap has the stuff for this.
Another would be to model it on a computer and have someone with a computer operated milling machine cut it out for you.
For some of them with lots of repeated shapes you could cut them out and glue together. One way to cut them would be to do it like they did the big sculptures near center camp this year - find a long extrusion with the profile you want and cut slices. For example, from a round tube you can get a bunch of circles, or ovals if you cut at an angle.
How big did you want them to be? Do they need to be clear? Acrylic is cheap and available but it's prone to cracking. Polycarbonate is a little tougher to work with but much stronger if you want clear. HDPE and UHMW are easy to machine and very tough. -
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Re: plastics anyone?
Sat, November 4, 2006 - 7:49 AMoK i'm gonna give away one of my secretes.
While often useing large styraphome blocks to make some of my bigger sulptures, I often use Elmers glue (in the gallon) to seal the foam so I can fiberglass the surface. After that it's all anding and grinding, then some aouto grade painting. Both the fiberglass resin and the paint will melt the foam otherwise. Sometimes I skip the fiberglass part and just paint the elmers glue surface. Works well enough. Anyways.....
I tried to skip useing sheets of moldable platic once by laying out sheets of clear vynal and covering them with the elmers glue and what I noticed was at a certain point in the drying time, they are sculptable. when dry they are frosty transparent. I cut them up into pieces and use this technique from time to time to avoid useing professional grade plastic molding sheet (not expensive0 but I work big enough that vynal and glue is cheaper. I imagine that someone with more time on their hands could come up with an even better formula.
oxoxo
fucko
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Re: plastics anyone?
Thu, January 4, 2007 - 9:27 PM
Ok. I finally decided on a process: I'll sculpt it in pieces out of (sculpey? shapelock? something else? still iffy here) and create a flexible mold. I'm completely confident in my ability to cast this.
I've also decided on material for the Haeckel thing: I'm about to purchase trial sizes of silicone in a variety of hardnesses from smooth-on.com
My problem comes at what material to actually make the mold out of. Silicone sticks to silicone, so making the mold out of flexible silicone rubber seems problematic. Urethane apparently inhibits silicone from curing? I'm still unclear how much. If so, a flexible urethane rubber seems like it could be trouble too. (And of course I a want flexible material so I can have the liberty to make complex shapes with overhangs, etc.)
So, um, I'm stuck at this point. I could purchase trial sizes of the materials in question and test, but that will be spendy. I can simply seal the mold well with petroleum jelly or a spray-on sealing agent, but I'm afraid that will change the texture of the finished silicone product. And it sucks that Douglas & Sturgess is only open when I'm at work M-F, though I can call and ask over my lunch break I'm sure...
But maybe I can also pose the question here: any suggestions?
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Re: plastics anyone?
Fri, January 5, 2007 - 9:40 AMNow you know why good mold makers are rare.
I always use an oil based seperater between mold and model. I've use everything from motor oil to baby oil. It makes clean up a handful but I'm always happier with the surface results and releaseability.
I know some people use soaps and water based lubricants but I've always had problems with them mixing with the resins.
A friend of mine toild me to use a fix (like for charcol drawings) but I've never tried it on latex or polyurithan molds.
For really expensive work I use the manufactures stock seperator, but it is expensive.
There are(or at least used to be) some good mold makers over at Artworks Foundry in Berkeley (7th and Hienz)
Chiodo enterprises in Oakland (mask making/horror film effects) aslo has soem great people in their mold dept. These would be fun advertures that would give you lots of helpful insight.
They will tell you to sculpt in Magisculpt.
oxoxo
fucko
Give'um -
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Re: plastics anyone?
Sun, February 4, 2007 - 10:10 PM
I wasn't happy with my sculptin gability and was itching to cast *something* so I picked up a nut-thing off the ground and had at it.
I used silicone for the mold, and cast it with a polyurethane liquid plastic. The result is here: flickr.com/photos/hyperborea/380225276/
Learned that more mold release is better no matter what you're using (first 'mold' became a nut-thing permanently embedded in a solid brick of silicone - oops.)
Making slow progess, thanks for the advice!
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Re: plastics anyone?
Mon, February 5, 2007 - 11:29 AMThose really looked great from the photos. A lot more details that would stump many other mold makers.
Congradulations.
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