OK....
Here's another piece of trivia which may or may not be important...although, I believe it is extremely important.
About 90 percent of Egyptian dancers -- pre Fifi Abdo, anyway -- are left sided. In fact Fifi herself is left sided. That is not to say that she is left handed, but rather left sided and executes or starts movement more on her left side rather than her right side. We in the USA are right sided and start or execute movement on our right side rather than our left side. In fact, many left handed dancers are taught right sided.
I've observed the following (and many many more not listed):
Fifi Abdo - ties scarf on left hip/ uses left hip, slit on left side; cane in right hand; favors left hip
Nahed Sabry - left hipped
Katie - left shoulder; turns right; favors left hip
Shosho - left handed; left sided
Nebawiya Moustafa - left hipped; ties scarf of left hip
Taheyia Karioka - left hipped; begins most of her moves on left hip; travels left mostly
Zinat Aloui - left sided
Hind Rostom (an actress dancing in movies) - left sided
Zizi Moustafa - left sided
I've observed numerous others including, but not limited to, Hanan, Nelly, Mona El Sayed, Hoda Shams El Din and others. Many of these dancers are left sided as well.
This is another topic I addressed on Med-dance list and was instantly shunned -- a topic having no importance whatsoever in the dance. I think it is very important to observe Egyptian dancers in everything they do and to understand why it is that they do it. My take on it is that Egyptians write from right to left so many may be left sided as a result of ending their sentences on the left. We, in America, write from left to right and so we take many of our steps beginning with our right foot. Additionally, every statue depicting the likeness of a person or god in Egypt, where the statue is standing with one leg forward, ALL stand with their left leg forward. The right leg is behind the left leg.
Because we, as a majority in America, are "right sided" and therefore learn this dance using our right side, we may be looking at Egyptian dance through a "right-sided" point of view which may distort our image of what is really going on with the Egyptian dancer who is dancing left sided.
How many of you have noticed this little but important detail?
-Sausan
Here's another piece of trivia which may or may not be important...although, I believe it is extremely important.
About 90 percent of Egyptian dancers -- pre Fifi Abdo, anyway -- are left sided. In fact Fifi herself is left sided. That is not to say that she is left handed, but rather left sided and executes or starts movement more on her left side rather than her right side. We in the USA are right sided and start or execute movement on our right side rather than our left side. In fact, many left handed dancers are taught right sided.
I've observed the following (and many many more not listed):
Fifi Abdo - ties scarf on left hip/ uses left hip, slit on left side; cane in right hand; favors left hip
Nahed Sabry - left hipped
Katie - left shoulder; turns right; favors left hip
Shosho - left handed; left sided
Nebawiya Moustafa - left hipped; ties scarf of left hip
Taheyia Karioka - left hipped; begins most of her moves on left hip; travels left mostly
Zinat Aloui - left sided
Hind Rostom (an actress dancing in movies) - left sided
Zizi Moustafa - left sided
I've observed numerous others including, but not limited to, Hanan, Nelly, Mona El Sayed, Hoda Shams El Din and others. Many of these dancers are left sided as well.
This is another topic I addressed on Med-dance list and was instantly shunned -- a topic having no importance whatsoever in the dance. I think it is very important to observe Egyptian dancers in everything they do and to understand why it is that they do it. My take on it is that Egyptians write from right to left so many may be left sided as a result of ending their sentences on the left. We, in America, write from left to right and so we take many of our steps beginning with our right foot. Additionally, every statue depicting the likeness of a person or god in Egypt, where the statue is standing with one leg forward, ALL stand with their left leg forward. The right leg is behind the left leg.
Because we, as a majority in America, are "right sided" and therefore learn this dance using our right side, we may be looking at Egyptian dance through a "right-sided" point of view which may distort our image of what is really going on with the Egyptian dancer who is dancing left sided.
How many of you have noticed this little but important detail?
-Sausan
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Sat, December 8, 2007 - 3:37 PMoh...one more thing...
I was told that Dr. Mo Geddawi and Raq'ia Hassan both dance and teach left sided. Interesting....no?
-Sausan -
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Sat, December 8, 2007 - 6:37 PMI noticed that a while ago. I took a workshop with Raqia earlier this year and she did a lot of moves that started with the left hip, which was a challenge for me. -
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Sun, December 9, 2007 - 12:30 AMIsn't that interesting? And I bet she is right handed. Lebleba is also left sided. In fact, almost ALL of the Egyptian made belly dance costumes have the slit up the left leg. That's because the majority of Egyptian dancers are left sided.
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Sun, December 9, 2007 - 9:49 AMThe American influence brings more eclectically trained dancers to the mix. Ballet, Jaz, Tap, Modern.. all prodomently trained from the right. My teacher teaches right, because that is what her teacher did. There is another area teacher that teaches left. Onoe of my troupies takes both classes and has learned to start both ways. I am trying to blend to the left more but with all my past dance experience Ihave a blockage. I feel this is because i learn all ME steps starting right and the right side became the driving force. I have danced Hula for many years and do not think about .. is this left.. or right.. I just do it.
It is an interesting observation. And I am sure we will for some time.. watch a video and go.. "there's left.. oh.. there's a right"
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Sun, December 9, 2007 - 11:46 AMI've never observed this before in others, but I did notice this in my own body.
Although I am right-hand dominant and spent 12-ish years studying ballet (also right-dominant), when I perform BD, I tend to favor my left hip. I think it just has to do with the fact that I feel more securely "planted" to the ground, stable and steady, with all my weight on my right leg, therefore leaving my left hip to do whatever it wants.
Could this possibly explain the left-hip popularity of famous Egytian dancers? Or am I the only one whose body functions like this? -
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Sun, December 9, 2007 - 7:32 PMI do the same thing. I also feel more secure having my weight planted on my right. People often ask if I'm left handed after seeing me dance.
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Sun, December 9, 2007 - 4:57 PMBeing left handed, I've always had a challenge in our right-handed world. I got used to starting on my right side for all dances and even when I started learning belly dancing, I INSISTED on learning it the right handed way. One fine day, that all crumbled apart and I've had to switch to the left and it honestly just looks better (probably because I am more relaxed being my left-handed and left-footed self). I'm glad to know that in Egyptian culture most of the greats are left-footed. At least I don't feel punished for being left-handed (the last to learn just about everything because I'm perpetually translating the movements from what my left WANTS to do vs what my right side SHOULD do. Good to be doing something that rewards the left side!).
I think culture and how we interpret the world in general has a lot to do with our tendency to do things on the right. At one point, the left side was associated with evil and being unclean -- for both hand and foot -- so that dissuaded quite a few people from being left-handed and favoring the right for daily activities (in some cases, the left hand couldn't be used except for specific activities). I agree with Sausan about language having an impact on sides (it's a plus writing Arabic with your left hand). I also wonder about the possibility of culture changing the person's hand preference (Western culture changed lefties to righties for years and only recently did that practice stop) -- so if that happened in Egypt as well, some of these women were actually lefties who switched due to cultural influence.
Another theory -- the right side is sometimes viewed as the "masculine" side and the left as the "feminine." That may have something to do with it as well. It would be interesting to see if the men start on their right or left for their dances.....
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Sun, December 9, 2007 - 10:08 PMI can't say as I've ever scrutinized Egyptian dancers with the level of attention needed to notice that. It's an interesting tidbit.
I wonder if it's related at all to the fact that many traditional debke steps from the Levant start on the left foot. Maybe there is some sort of pervasive tendency throughout the Eastern Mediterranean region to dance left-sided that dates back centuries or even farther ago? An interesting question to which I'm afraid I have no answers! -
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Mon, December 10, 2007 - 1:56 PM"I can't say as I've ever scrutinized Egyptian dancers with the level of attention needed to notice that. It's an interesting tidbit."
Ditto.
All my training in this dance has been balanced. We train both left and right sided. Since I am naturally ambidextrous it really doesnt matter how you start a move. However if your only dancing one sided then you will have an imbalance of muscle coordination and balance and strength. In my opinion that does not make for a good dancer cause it limits your ability and expression.
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Mon, December 10, 2007 - 7:14 PM"My take on it is that Egyptians write from right to left so many may be left sided as a result of ending their sentences on the left."
Although literacy rates for women have recently improved in Egypt, a good number of dancers in the 70's and before never learned to read or write. Fifi has compared herself to the illiterate Shabaan Abdelrahim in her humble beginnings; she could only pay for an education when she became rich and famous. But I wonder if such a general cultural norm, such as sentences ending on the left, could be true even for those lacking in an education... -
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Tue, December 11, 2007 - 2:47 PMYou post an interesting perspective. As a nation in the West, even illiterate women could see literate individuals (males and perhaps females) write or sign their names from left to right. So, I wonder, if even subconsciously and subliminally they didn't pick up the right sidedness over the left-sidedness of the Egyptian culture. Fifi, being self taught, is left sided...an Egyptian where the nation writes from right to left. -
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Wed, December 12, 2007 - 6:54 PMI'm a little confused about how the writing would translate to dance movement. And why wouldn't people who start writing on the left side (i.e., us) start dancing on the left side, and vice versa?
I do think it's a cool observation though. My theory would be that so many Western dances, especially ballroom dances, start on the right foot. If you're in the US and you come to oriental dance a little later in life, your chances are high of having had the "start on the right foot' mantra drilled into you at some point. That foot is just ready to go! -
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Thu, December 13, 2007 - 12:02 AMHi, Atisheh...
It's just an observation that, in my opinion, is worth investigating.
I'm not sure what foot the Egyptian military begins their marches on, but in the US, the military begins marching on their left foot. And that's quite interesting as well. Initially, the military was a male occupation. With this in mind, men also begin their dance with females, specifically in arm-in-arm as in the waltz, on their left foot. Women and men in Egypt were often separated and so therefore the two were never paired up to dance together.
Interesting observations. -
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Thu, December 13, 2007 - 7:27 AMI was trained to use both sides, but the left side is predominately the lead foot for walking and hip drops, while the right side is for more complicated shimmies that require more strength.
When I was in marching band the lead foot was always the left.
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Thu, December 13, 2007 - 8:00 AMThe literacy-effect is an interesting thought Kamilia.
I was always left-hipped naturally (I"m right-handed tho); and also learned about that particular "Egyptian-style" fact long ago too. BUT - depending on how much you dance, I guess - this is NOT so great for your right side. You run the risk of wearing out your "standing" joint if you're way too one-sided. Now I am training myself to "go to the right hip" consciously, to use that side more now. It's a very "conscious" decision tho - sure doesn't come natural. -
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Fri, December 14, 2007 - 7:29 AMPerhaps it is nothing so complicated as 'handedness', if you are right handed you are more likely to be stronger, more muscular & less flexible on the right as a result it would feel more 'natural' to feel planted with your weight on your right leg and have more freedom on the left?
Sorry if I overuse the '' but it's hard to add stress or emphasis otherwise.
I've also noted I stand to the left in workshops and my teacher has pointed out it's begun to affect how I stay centered in certain moves, brains eh? :-)
Remind me, what side of the brain relates to what function? -
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Sun, December 16, 2007 - 10:21 AMI just got a funny factoid from my Egyptian fiance', which I thought would be fun for this discussion. A common superstition in Egypt is to enter places on the right foot (the bathroom, a new apartment or business, etc.) to keep the devil away. Funny, no? -
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Sun, December 16, 2007 - 2:02 PMThat's great to know! Another factoid about superstition is that in entering the new year, all trash/garbage cans should be washed out and turn over on New Years Eve to allow the bad spirits to leave the home. This can be done throughout the year, but it's almost always done by everyone on New Years Eve.
I love tradition. -
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Mon, December 17, 2007 - 7:42 AMSorry, I hope I didn't imply that this tradition was funny (start with right), but what do you think it means for the dancers who have a penchant for the left? Are we really all she-devils?
I like the trashcans. I think I'll con my honey into doing that for me every week, threatening him with my possession by bad spirits. -
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This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.
Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Mon, December 17, 2007 - 3:18 PMI'm sure some of us have been she-devils at one point or another in our lives, even for one minute. I don't know what a she-devil is, though......
Some tradition can appear to be funny outside our cultural norm. I didn't believe that I was stating something funny, just something unusual and different from what we know in the USA. -
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Tue, December 18, 2007 - 6:51 AMI knew you weren't stating it was funny, I just didn't want anyone to misinterpret my comments : )
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Mon, December 17, 2007 - 3:49 PMCool! Romanians have a superstition about leaving home with the right foot. If you're going to do something important, like take an exam or go on a long voyage, you step out of your doorway on the right foot. At one point, it gets so ingrained into you that you don't even think about it anymore!
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Sat, December 29, 2007 - 5:13 PMI love this topic. :D
I am definitely right-sided and I'm trying in earnest to help my left side catch up. I've also noticed other dancers, who execute certain moves with a little more 'oomph' with one side or the other.
Since handedness is the most visible way to tell how the brain is organized, I've been experimenting with doing things with my left hand (I'm right handed) to see how much effect this has on my brain altogether, and therefore the muscles. Not because I think there's some magic trick involved to switching hands and dancing differently, but I think it's good exercise for the brain. I know the scientific research on handedness is very extensive, and there seems to be something to how ambidextrous you are, effecting things you do creatively. Or I think that's how I remember it. I think before I started shifting to my left hand, I would suddenly have a little left/right directional confusion while drilling if I wasn't concentrating hard enough and it was like my brain suddenly forgot what we were doing. *sigh* -
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Sun, December 30, 2007 - 7:12 AMhaha- I've been in dance classes so long I can't remember which is left & which is right- do you want me to mirror you, or go in the same direction even tho it looks opposite. I point a lot in class 'cause if I start calling out left or right, I just confuse everybody (myself included!)
I think handedness in dance can have a lot to do with who you learned from. in some styles it can be a useful tool (like for cuing in ATS) and I think it is good to be able to do movements equally well on both sides, but as long as you are working both sides at some point, I don't see any harm in starting predominantly to one side. I bought into the idea of balanced sides for physical fitness for a while, but as an instrumentalist whose right hand gets a lot more exercise than the left, there may be differences in muscle strength, but I still have full use of both hands, so I don't know if I can buy into that line anymore, unless you are only ever moving in one direction or doing ALL accents on one side, and there is no outside exercise/practice balancing things out. Ouch, that was a run on sentence! I do exercises to keep my hands limber, just as I do fitness classes outside of dance to keep the rest of my body balanced.
Of course, that would be one advantage to maintaining a coach or mentor of some kind who can help look out for weaknesses, both physical and artistic.
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Sun, December 30, 2007 - 9:53 AMI think these observations are very good. A short while ago I noticed that whenever I was about to improvise, any bigger, meaningful or more challenging movement I automatically start from the right side. On spins it is most annoying to notice that while I'm ok on the right the left is not ok at all so it is automatically avoided when switching on the autopilot.
I asked my teacher if in the new year she could more often start from the left - but I guess she'll stick to her habits.
I wonder if this has got to do with writing. The majority in my country is right handed, it is obviously easier for writing towards the right, but the preference shows much earlier, before a kid learns to write, so why is this?
How about the connection with the sides of the brain? The right side is connected with the left brain half, and the other way round, or? -
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Sun, December 30, 2007 - 8:33 PM
"I wonder if this has got to do with writing. The majority in my country is right handed, it is obviously easier for writing towards the right, but the preference shows much earlier, before a kid learns to write, so why is this?"
It's not just your country, it's all over, Nuria. Righties outnumber lefties in general. :) I don't have any numbers on it, but most humans are right-handed. The left brain is considered dominate to the right brain, because of language function and other "dominant" tasks, and the left brain controls the right hand. So, righties pop up a lot I guess. But by no means is the left brain actually dominate, as in it's better. Both halves eare qually awesome, both high functioning, just functioning in different ways. :D
"How about the connection with the sides of the brain? The right side is connected with the left brain half, and the other way round, or?"
Both halves of the brain are connected to each other, and share information and work together, but each can function separately. Left controls the right hand, right controls the left hand.
I love how this whole topic is SO very left brain for something like bellydancing! :D -
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Sun, December 30, 2007 - 9:48 PMI find that being left handed, I am very dyslexic regarding someone saying left or right but can do clockwise or counterclockwise no problem. Or when driving N S E W is the only way I can conceive it...streets on a diagonal COMPLETELY mess me up.
I find that although I prefer my left side in bellydance, due to my training thus far I am very un coordinated on that side...which means that my at home drilling will consist of building up what already should be my natural strong side.
I asked this question on a different forum, but I am curious -- does the fact that the writing goes from right to left, and historically speaking a right handed person would smudge the ink, therefore mean that more Arabs are left handed than the general population worldwide? At least for writing? I know many ME drummers of ME descent and all of them are left handed, so it makes me wonder. Or, is it simply that more artistic people tend to be left handed (which I have noticed for a long time, grew up in a very artsy family)?
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Mon, December 31, 2007 - 2:05 AMHi Rem,
that was my point. Are right handed people more dominated by their left brainside or is this connection better developped than left-hand-right side of brain, and that is why the righties are the majority?
And the dancers in Egypt that prefer the left: are they left handed at the same time? Or are the "righties" in the majority there, too? -
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Mon, December 31, 2007 - 7:49 AMnote from my soccer playing husband- wanted to throw in that it is not unusual for right handed people to be left footed when it comes to sports. -
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Mon, December 31, 2007 - 8:32 AMI agree with the sports somment. As a gymnast I was always leading left on power moves but I am right handed.
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Thu, January 3, 2008 - 6:45 PMHmm. Lemme see. I think my last post was the extent of my 'off the top of my head' knowledge, lemme grab one of my texts, cause I'm lazy and I won't allow my brain to retain anything I learned in classes for fear it'll hog precious resources needed for me to beat the pants off friends at trivia.
But I think the answer to your first question is yes! Because language trumps a lot of other stuff, but...I do know that right handers have a more difficult time than left handers at using both sides, equally. Or something like that. I forget what it's called. But righties can be dominated by one side or the other, left or right, more easily than a left handed person.
Hang on! :D -
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Thu, January 3, 2008 - 8:09 PMLateralization! That's what word I was thinking of. ;) (I'm gonna start quoting some book-learnin' here, throwing numbers out.)
Lateralization is the degree to which specfic brain funtions are carried out almost exclusively by one half of the brain, or the other half
Generally... Lefties are less "lateralized" than righties. Meaning their brains can process things that are usually specific to one side or the other, on both sides of their brain with more ease than righties.
90% of humans are right-handed.
Specifically, language is mediated in the left brain in 90% of right-handed people, but 70% of left-handers. (there's more numbers in the remaining percentages, a mixture of both, but dunno if you want all of that! :D )
About this and dancing... I dunno. Because I'm so curious about my own little lefty experimenting, I intend to do more research into this area (cause I do love research!) and see what studies have been done on movements and lateralization, beyond basic motor functions and stuff like that. I'm wondering if it is in fact a factor in left handed dancers because of less lateralization -
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Tue, March 11, 2008 - 8:02 AMIt is a very interesting phenomenon that I have been trying to sort it out myself for a while. I can use both hands but was taught to use my right because of cultural belief (Chinese) that using left hand brings bad omen to self and family. While I am right handed in playing sports and everything else, I naturally use my left side when it comes to dancing and playing drums. I have to train my brain to use right side. In driving, I love turning left but feel uneasy turning right. I also like to tie things to my left, carry bags and things on my left. It was a breeze for me to march in left while my cadet mates struggled. Could this be cultural as Chinese Language also reads/writes from right as Egyptian? It can also be related with our body symmetry, our taught preferences, etc.
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Wed, March 12, 2008 - 5:27 PMI'm not so sure if it has anything to do with the writing systems - I think it's more about how the dancer were taught. A left sided dancer will teach others that way, and they will probably not go against it. They will teach others, and before you know it, you have a bunch of Egyptians dancing to the left.
I myself learned in the very beginning that we stand on right leg and bring left leg forward, on ball of foot to pose. I just picked that up like hat (6 years ago) and never thought to change it, especialy since all costumes I've seen have slits on left side.
I am myself left handed with right dominant, yet I still do mostly everything on the left (legs, hips,etc) I turn and spin both ways, but usually turn or spin only to the left with my sword.
So I think it's the teaching.
I also think we should be balanced, and do everything both way for muscle development and that so our dance won't be one sided.
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Mon, March 24, 2008 - 1:29 PMI don't necessarily believe that there is any hard and fast rule on where movements are started or executed in the US. Many people who are right handed are left footed. Much or where you would orient movements would depend on your stage or dance venue--where you enter, where your audience is. I have learned many choreographies from American dancers that began with the left rather than the right side.
Does it make a difference? Probably not.
In class I tie my hip scarf on the right because I right handed and it is easier to do it on the right side. When I perform I tie it on the left because I have larger hip movements with more range of motion on that side and tend to default to my left hip.
My choice not dictated by any rules or regulations.
Souzan
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Mon, March 24, 2008 - 1:33 PMSausan wronte:
"This is another topic I addressed on Med-dance list and was instantly shunned -- a topic having no importance whatsoever in the dance."
I remember that discussion and don't recall you being shunned so much as others not embracing your point. Big difference...
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Tue, March 25, 2008 - 12:04 AMThis is not about bellydance, but a general thing. My second flamenco teacher tried to force me to play the castanets the same way like a right handed person. I had a hard time with castanets anyway, and doing all the fast, complicated patterns with my right hand was almost impossible for me, but she insisted, saying, she could not teach me, otherwise. After a while I noticed that her entire dance was right sided. Every movement was ALWAYS started with the right arm, the right foot, all the difficuilt stuff done on the right side. And asking a left-hander to use her right side, buh !
I appreciate teachers flexible enough to accomodate their students indualities. And yes, I think, a balanced way of dance might look better. -
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Re: Left Sided or Right Sided?
Tue, March 25, 2008 - 12:05 AMBy the way, Hebrew is written from the right to the left, I have seen it. Maybe a genetic thing in those areas?
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