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You know the ones I mean... Those braided fabric belts, usually bright colors, usually tied around waists of the lower classes..... Are they something that those people would have had? I've often wondered, please enlighten me if you can! Ta. :D
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Sacramento
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Re: What is the history of those rag belt things?
Thu, June 18, 2009 - 7:26 AMI vote Califairism.
Not seeing what you're describing very often in the east or mid, except occasioanally on a poorly- or fancifully-dressed patron (the kind that wear foxtails and fairy wings).
Never seen anything like that in contemporary art.
Sure, they would have had braided rags. Those are for making rugs, though, not wearing. "The item could have existed but is not known to have been used that way in the time frame we're discussing." Possible, but not fashionable.
Just watch, somebody'll dig up a painting showing somebody with something similar-looking, and then it'll be all braided rag belts and fishmen. ;) -
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Re: What is the history of those rag belt things?
Thu, June 18, 2009 - 8:27 AMBut I don't wanna be a fishman! I wanna be the guy stuck in the clear globe! -
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Re: What is the history of those rag belt things?
Thu, June 18, 2009 - 10:26 AMMost likely a whimsical faire fashion. I'd bet money that nobody saw it in a period source and decided to recreate it.
It makes more sense than many others, though.
I've seen it done as hat decoration, too. Looks good and doesn't scream "wrong" to me. Anybody have any period pix of that affectation? -
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Re: What is the history of those rag belt things?
Thu, June 18, 2009 - 10:37 AMI think it was a clothing merchant's solution to left over scraps of fabrics. I know Lady and the Fool sets their people to making them when the booth isn't busy. They probably didn't invent the idea. So yes, I guess that makes it a CalFaire-ism. -
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Re: What is the history of those rag belt things?
Thu, June 18, 2009 - 11:25 AMI agree that it was begun by a clothing booth. For best results, though, you can't really use scraps to make these, as they come out too skinny. I do think they were looking for a low-cost alternative for belts, and maybe even one that would obviously not be leather.
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Re: What is the history of those rag belt things?
Thu, June 18, 2009 - 2:03 PMOops!
Did I say occasio-anally?
Like seldom, and it looks like arse to me? (like foxtails and fairy wings to my aesthetic tase)
There's a Freudian slip... Ya know, when you say one thing and mean amother.
I would think them kinda cute on a hippy dress at a folk festival, but not my preference at a renaissance event (although less offensive to my eyes than victorian corset with no smock)
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Re: What is the history of those rag belt things?
Thu, June 18, 2009 - 2:09 PMI could see it as part of some sort of festival / fool / masquers attire.
Seems like something a Landsknecht might do. -
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Re: What is the history of those rag belt things?
Thu, June 18, 2009 - 3:07 PMAs trim? I would have to do some looking, but I would be a little surprised to find that on a German. Most of the trim bits are pretty 'standard' looking (flat braids, pinked fabric loops, etc.) for general purpose wear and the fools costumes are actually almost 'medieval' in their simplicity – long sleeves, ass ears and tassels being their main trimmings (at least in the examples I can recall from the Narrenschift and other ‘fools books’).
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Re: What is the history of those rag belt things?
Thu, June 18, 2009 - 1:44 PMFake. Bogus. False. -
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Re: What is the history of those rag belt things?
Fri, June 19, 2009 - 11:55 AMWow, thanks for all that! I only asked because my ex-boss told me they were for.... um..... tying people up for... well...... rather bawdy purposes. I guess she got the wrong idea somewhere. She used to be with a guild, I can't at this moment recall the name. -
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Re: What is the history of those rag belt things?
Fri, June 19, 2009 - 12:03 PMThey may have very well been used for that purpose by faire performers. -
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Re: What is the history of those rag belt things?
Fri, June 19, 2009 - 1:25 PM"They may have very well been used for that purpose by faire performers. "
Maybe her guild did do that or knew of folks who did.
I second Rydell's assertion. I also will add that although that might be/might have been - whatever - the case, that it was most likely not the original intention of the accessory.
Of course many things that are made, at faire and elsewhere, can be said of the same. People use all sorts of things made for one purpose expressly for many non-intended things.
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Re: What is the history of those rag belt things?
Fri, June 19, 2009 - 8:20 PM
Well, not so bawdy but, I recall girls out in Agoura and early Berdo, would have multi-colored braided ribbon for what they called the "Fairy Ring" they get you inside the ribbon and then, to get out you have to give each girl a kiss. Never any bawdier then that though at least not out here in Cali >shrug< -
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Re: What is the history of those rag belt things?
Sat, June 20, 2009 - 1:16 AMAw, I like the Fairy Ring idea lol. -
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Re: What is the history of those rag belt things?
Sat, June 20, 2009 - 10:11 AMThe "Fairy Ring" thing eventually got banned in some shows because not all victims were willing and not all the "Fairies" were polite and gentle.
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Re: What is the history of those rag belt things?
Sat, June 20, 2009 - 11:55 PMIn my local faires, that gig got called a "hog tie" or a "fairy ring" depending on who did them. I used to love those, but yeah, they eventually did get out of hand. -
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Unsu...
Re: What is the history of those rag belt things?
Sun, June 21, 2009 - 9:23 PMhow old is the mumming tradition?
/too lazy to look it up, but suspecting it's later than Elizabethan... -
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Re: What is the history of those rag belt things?
Mon, June 22, 2009 - 10:58 AMThe earliest written examples we have are from the early 18th century.
Wiki (with the usual provisos):
"Although the term "mummers" has been used since medieval times, no play scripts or performance details survive from that era, and the term may have been used loosely to describe performers of several different kinds. Mumming may have precedents in German and French carnival customs, with rare but close parallels also in late medieval England.
The earliest evidence of mummers' plays as they are known today (usually involving a magical cure by a quack doctor) is from the mid to late 18th century. Mumming plays should not be confused with the earlier mystery plays."
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