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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Mon, May 28, 2007 - 8:08 PMto get alkaloids out requires alot of work and not worth it really
but usually one get grind the pods and eat them or drink them down with some grapefruit juice.
or one lightly slices the pods to get raw opium to ooze out which is later collected, illegal in most places in teh world though -
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Thu, June 7, 2007 - 11:27 AMpretty much what he said ~ it's legal to grow the plants but if "they" (i'm assuming dea?) find the poppy heads with slices in them, not so good. and it's really hard work. not sure if the latex is water-soluable (anyone know, i have always wondered this, same with lactuca, is it water-sol?)
anyways, even if it's partially water-sol, you can make a tea, just simmer in water (on low, for a while) and prob add something for flavor, 'cause it's awfully bitter. -
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Thu, July 5, 2007 - 10:35 AMAnd the seed pods need to be at just the right stage of maturation to get the most out of it. I made some tea yesterday to use instead of a painkiller....didn't really get an effect because they weren't mature enough yet when I picked them.
Shucks.
And I sliced them, very little sap. I have heard that you need to slice them when they are on the stalk still? Anyone have experience with this yet? -
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Unsu...
Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Thu, July 5, 2007 - 1:31 PMa few years i fell and cracked a couple of ribs and a friend made poppy tea for me. as i remember he steeped it for a good long while. it actually was pretty effective in reducing the pain and helping me breathe and then get to sleep. -
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Thu, July 5, 2007 - 2:02 PMI only steeped them for 10 minutes after bringing it up to a boil. That could be it.
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Mon, January 21, 2008 - 6:54 AMI heard you wait a couple weeks after the flowers drop.
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Thu, July 5, 2007 - 6:02 PMGood to hear about his....i have some beautiful pods in my garden....I was told the ones with the browns spots(that's the resin) are most potent.....and yes, I am told it is illegal if you admit to knowing about the opium and if you are ignorant it is not....I have tried the tea and it made me very sleepy and got rid of a morning back ache I was having. Has anyone made tincture?......peace, Julie -
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Thu, July 5, 2007 - 6:09 PMooooohhh tincture. I would also think a decoction would be more potent than tea? -
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Mon, November 19, 2007 - 8:44 AMTincture is pretty easy to make but I think one of the questions I wanted to reply to was the solubility of the latex. Well it is and it is part of the process of makings smoking opium. All of the sap is collected (you get about 4 cuts out of one pod the 3rd is the best) Then it is dissolved in water and filtered. This gets rid of all the plant matter. Then the water is slowly evaporated and the last part can be done in the sun. This gives you "smoking opium" The poppies in Turkey are harvested dry on the stalk which was supposed to stop illegal bleeding of pharmaceutical opium plantations for conversion to morphine. These pods are available through the florists of all places and it is pretty simple to do basic extractions. Its only when you are getting to making dia-morphine that the chemicals needed are regulated. They are used in the perfume industry which was the reason behind the French connection. For simple extractions it does not take a rocket scientist to get it right. -
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Fri, November 23, 2007 - 5:12 PM"A friend of mine" makes poppy tea every spring (enjoys it for a couple of weeks, and then leaves opiates alone for the rest of the year). She reports:
*Milking the poppies is not only a potential bust, but also a tedious pain in the ass.
*A LONG boil (overnight in plenty of water) makes a more potent tea. (not being a chemist like many of you, I couldn't say for sure but it would seem that the morphine is totally stable at temps. under 100 Centigrade and that it is in fact water soluble.
*Said tea can be reduced to a small amount of water and then liberally sugared to make a syrup that could keep for a long period in the frij
This is really easy
Sweet dreams.............
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Mon, January 21, 2008 - 6:55 AMWhat is a decoction? -
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Fri, April 24, 2009 - 9:37 PMMeans a tea. Often boiled down to concentrate. -
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Sat, April 25, 2009 - 1:36 AMTake the dried poppies and grind em up fine' seeds n' all' with methanol and a splash of white wine vinegar in a liquidiser'
Poor all of the sludge into a large jam jar and shake the jar a couple of times a day for one week'
Let the jar finaly settle and decant off the alcohol'
Filter the methanol and pour it into a large bowl'
Stand the bowl in a pan of boiling water and cook off almost most of the methanol'
Scrape up the black tar and roll in balls' leave somewhere warm to dry'
This will give you potent tar of which is high in codiene and contains quite a bit of morphine'
Blessings
Nobuoni +
Acetone works also for this tech and evaporates a wee bit faster than methanol' use lots of pods and straw' and liquidise it real well' masserating it into the spirit'
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Sat, April 25, 2009 - 9:18 AMAny reason ethanol wouldn't work?
In the poppies.org forums there's a good recipe for for a sort of laudanum (he calls it laudrum). I'd include a link, but the forums are members only. Anyone can sign up though, and if ya do the recipe is in the "best of" section. -
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Sat, April 25, 2009 - 10:08 AMYes ethanol works' but you got to pay tax on it' also you no wish to have lots of water in it' so at least 98%'
Methanol is real cheap and works really well for this tech'
Another way is to use strong spirit and masserate the plant material in this' soak it' decant' filter' then evap a lot of the spirit'
Makes a powerful tincture'
Blessings
Nobuoni +
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Sat, April 25, 2009 - 11:07 AMYeah, methanol is better solvent somewhat, but is poison. No harm if you evap it all off though. Denatured alcohol is usually a mix of two and no tax. Cheap as well. Maybe easier to find. Either one as long as all is evaped off.
The laudrum recipe uses water boil first, then alcohol. Works VERY good. Was wrong. Can read forums without being member. Here's link--
forum.poppies.org/index.php -
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This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.
Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Sat, April 25, 2009 - 11:45 AMMethanol is fine unless you ingest a fluid ounce of it'
My reasoning for no having much water is it is hard to cook off an water boils at 100' the same temp that kills morphine in solution'
All denatured alcohol here has Napth and methol violet in it along with methanol'
Blessings
Nobuoni + -
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Sat, April 25, 2009 - 12:00 PMDenatured alcohol in my local store is only ethanol and methanol, but can vary. Heard of DA sometimes having napth, but methyl violet? Would turn it blue, no? Must be the blue stuff left behind after evaping coleman fuel. Wondered what that was.
Napth evaps off too. Have used it for extracting other things. Just make sure it all evaps. Easy test--pour some in shallow pan and cover with screen. Put fan on it. Let evaporate and see if pan is clean after. If it leaves any residue behind don't use it. Otherwise is Ok. Always test like this even if using "pure" methanol. Anything not food grade or lab grade could have dissolved solids in it. Anything from hardware store is not necessarily "pure" even if label says so.
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Sat, April 25, 2009 - 12:20 PMThe tech mentioned would work better back wards'
Take your dried heads and staw and finely powder it'
3 times soak and extact with methanol'
Let the methanol sit to decant then filter it'
Pour it in a big bowl and stand in a hot water bath and evaporate all of the methanol'
Then mix your tar with of what you like to drink' or just vapourise a pea sized piece of tar'
Virgin Methanol is about $1.75 litre'
Sweet dreams
Blessings
Nobuoni + -
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Sat, April 25, 2009 - 12:36 PMMethanol BP is ~68 deg C at 1 atm
Water 100 deg C'
Alks degrade at 100 deg C'
Use alcohol and add a good lump of hash' ascorbic acid or acetic acid' convert all the alks to ascorbates/acetates' of which are extremely water/alcohol soluble'
Bliss
Nobuoni + -
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Sat, April 25, 2009 - 12:48 PMThis tar can be cleaned in solution by basing it with Calcium Hydroxide solution' this converts the morphine to Calcium Morphinate of which is water soluble' all the other alks become insoluble in base solution and fall to the bottom' (keep the sludge it is full of codiene)
Decant off the top layer and nutralise the solution with acetic acid and add peppermint oil' this converts the morphine back to acetyl morphine of which is highly water soluble'
Codiene converts to acetyl morphine in the body' morphine converts to acetyl-morphine in the body'
Bliss
Nobuoni +
Anyone got any more info on these beautiful plants'
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Sat, April 25, 2009 - 12:47 PMHm. I think you are probably right. Some people experience a difference between water and alcohol extract though, and some like water better. Maybe a difference in alk profile extracted. 50 some odd alks in poppies. The laudrum tech IS a pain evaping off the water.
Used to have a soxhlet setup. THAT would be ideal. Loved that thing. Like art, watching it work.
Virgin methanol can have additives like lubricants or just impurities. Seriously, always evap test anything not food grade. Just because the label says 99.99% pure doesn't make it so, and that .01% can add up when evaporating down. -
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Sat, April 25, 2009 - 12:57 PMGood point on the Virgin Methanol' evaporation tests on a sheet of glass come up clean' but always check your solvents for adulterants'
Yes' you got to love a soxhlet attraction'
The alcohol extracts 17 alkaloids from the plant' I have heard water extracts 22' so possibly the combo of lks is of what folks like'
The alcohol extractions have less lipids and also less of the alks that cause nausia' smokes just like opium'
he he he' Summer is coming fast' lots of waste ground and fields to bomb' letthe flower petals fall off and the little crown stand up' then pull the whole plant roots and all and dry them' the whole of the plant contains alkaloids' no just he pods' also he seeds have miniscual alks' so save some seed for next year and liquidise the rest in alcohol'
Bliss
Nobuoni +
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Thu, July 5, 2007 - 7:36 PMI just finished making a tinc. of prickly poppy. Very effective, I used a few pounds of plant though. One teaspoon and your pain is gone and you want a bed. :) -
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Fri, July 6, 2007 - 1:21 AMAnyone use matilla poppy? The color of the leaves made my mouth water.
I want very bad to have someone write an article for the entheogen review on a cross comparison of poppies.
I want to try prickly poppy.
I'm also going to get a bunch of coral root orchid.....experiment with that.
lets start a whole topic of opiate substitutes in Anatomyofthebodyofgod tribe -
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Mon, January 14, 2008 - 11:52 AMI just grow the pods (hen and chick variety) and let them do their thing.
Then after the petals fall off, I usually wait for a week, then I give them one good slice along
the TOP of the bulb.
Then, I don't collect the resin but I let it "Scab" over.
Afetr two more days, I cut them down (Low on the stalk) and put them in a cedar coat closet to dry.
It takes about two weeks for them to dry all the way.
After that, you can make Tea's, Extract's,Tincture's,Putty or just eat 'em whole like I do sometimes.
The reason I slice along the top of the pod is to limit the amount of latex that leaks out.
Also, when I slice them, I do it rather deeply, so that the latex drains INTO the pod instead of outside the pod.
Then after this is done I wait so the pods can "fill up".
I do it this way because it is easier and less work than scraping the pods over and over and over.
Plus, I don't want to be seen scraping them either.
I plant a big, long, fat row of them and it is usually enough for me and a few freinds.
If they aren't abuse, they will last quite a while.
Another good thing about growing your own is that you will have plenty of seed's to grow next year ( and they are also good for Tea!). After a few seasons of growing them on your own land (or where ever) they are more "Acclimated" to that particular area, so they grow even more Robust year after year.
Well worth the effort. -
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Mon, January 14, 2008 - 12:25 PMI've also got some hens and chicks germinating. I did not know the made the desired alkyloids as well. -
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Unsu...
Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Mon, January 14, 2008 - 1:07 PMNot hens and chicks like the succulent I believe they are talking about Papaver s. var. hens and chicks... right? -
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Tue, January 15, 2008 - 7:02 AMyes poppy hens and chicks. my wife bought 'em and i'm planting them. I didn't know they would give me gifts.
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Wed, August 29, 2007 - 3:13 PMThe tincture used to be the houswives favorite as drinking was frowned upon. look up laudinum. As I said in another post all you do is bleed the poppies (you get about 4 per poppy) collect the resin and disolve it in water (bring it to simmer) then filter out all the plant solids and you have a tincture alcahol can also be added which helps it keep although opium keeps well on it own. You can take this one step further and evaporate the water, steam of what you can then leave it in the sun or over a radiator and you have smoking opium. It ends up a bit tougher than hash but the idea is ti take a small ball on the end of a long needle and heat it over a spirit burner till it bubbles then push it into the pipe. An opium pipehas a small bown and the needle leaves a hole through the middle..smoke with a burner or a torch for cooking or cigar lighter. alternately once the gum has been heated it can be crumbled so you can smoke it any way you please ,on a bong with weed (tried that) or tobacco.
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Mon, December 24, 2007 - 4:21 PMI too am interested in the legality of poppy pods. I pretty sure ingnorance of it's potential could not be used as an escape from punishment. But what if they were not sliced to produce the juice? What if they were just growing? You can buy 'em on ebay, after all.... -
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Unsu...
Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Mon, December 24, 2007 - 4:27 PMthe dried pods are legal for floral arrangements (LOL WTF)
and as some of you may know make a GREAT tea...
but the TEA is ILLEGAL. yes. you guys know all that already.
supposedly it's legal to grow these babies
but something tells me not to plant any.
am I just paranoid?
can I grow these flowers and not worry?
or are the feds going to show up at my door just for growing a few lovelies?
WE HUMANS LIKE TO OCCASIONALLY FEEL GOOD.
FUCK OFF
with your sunglasses,
your ring modulated sirens,
and your rifles.
Ahem. I love poppies. america freaks me out. carry on. -
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Mon, December 24, 2007 - 5:31 PMQuite. martini-swilling, cigar smoking Nazis telling me I can't put a plant ina blender to feel good once in awhile. May they all FOAD>
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Sat, April 25, 2009 - 9:25 AMThe pods and even the plants are actually technically illegal, but just aren't enforced. There's little old ladies all over with flower beds full of em and the pods are sold online for "flower arrangements."
As a practical matter your probably safe as long as you don't have whole fields of them growing and/or don't get caught scoring the pods.
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Sat, July 7, 2007 - 2:50 PMwe just boildown the bulbs and stems after harvest strain the material after an hour or two and continue reducing the mixture til it gets goopy then spread on a glass baking pan and dry it at the absolute lowest temp in your oven...dehydrators r better the resulting material can be smoked in a hookah or such...does the trick
i know i'm not getting all the alkoloids but we sure r getting alot -
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Sat, July 7, 2007 - 11:22 PMI do that with dicentra root. Want to trade? -
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Sun, July 8, 2007 - 11:28 AMi'm not familiar, solid
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Wed, August 29, 2007 - 3:03 PMthats not a good way to make opium
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Wed, August 29, 2007 - 3:01 PMthe process of making smoking opium is to bleed the poppies a maximum of 4 scoars per poppy. The milk that excreted changes to a darke brown and is collected painstaikingly than boiled with water and filtered to create smoking opium, to take the extraction further would need other chemicals especially if you are going for no4 diacetilemorphine -
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Mon, December 24, 2007 - 4:22 PMdiacetyl morphine, heh heh -
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Wed, December 26, 2007 - 6:00 PMI got some poppies growing, they're very small, 1 inch or less. The ones inside by the window are weak but tall, falling over and dying, and the ones outside are very short, 1/2 inch,but apparently hearty. I don't expect any of them to make it, it's too cold, but as long as they don't freeze, they might be ok. If they take off I will have to move them to an undisclosed area which none of you can find- BWAHAHAHA!!
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Sat, April 25, 2009 - 9:32 AMNo sense in boiling it for smoking opium. Just collect the latex and let it dry. If you boil and filter you'd probably be better off vaporizing instead of smoking... course you'd probably be better of vaporizing in either case. And anyway, boiling and filtering is an unnecessary and pointless step.
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Re: Papaver somniferum Paeoniflorum- extraction
Sat, April 25, 2009 - 9:20 AMYou've all been noticed.