HIV-AIDS hoax

Hello all. Gos, I hope you didn't hold your breath too long, I've been fighting a cold. Anyways, let's get started.

One more thing I should have listed in my conspiracy myth diatribe is that sometimes people go for conspiracy theories because something is truly wrong with the “official” explanation, or some of the “officials” either don’t know themselves or they fuck up badly. The early days of the AIDS epidemic were confusing and terrifying for millions of Americans: first the medical community was wrong about exactly how contagious HIV was, and then they inadvertently gave it to thousands of hemophiliacs and other patients. So naturally, many people grew suspicious and lost trust in the establishment.


In direct response to some of the things that Gos has posted here:

"Wilner never himself developed HIV infection or AIDS as a result."
That's because he died of a heart attack 6 months later, that's why he never developed AIDS.

"though mainstream scientists admit they have no idea how it does it [how HIV causes AIDS]"
You don't need to know the exact mechanism in order to prove causation. PLENTY of pathogens have been correctly implicated in various diseases without researchers figuring out every detail of their precise mechanisms.


“1) AIDS is a very real threat to our species, when traffic accidents kill 3x more Americans than AIDS, and no one is saying that traffic accidents are a threat to our species.”
Traffic accidents do not spread from person to person the same way that infectious diseases do. The two are completely different problems and it makes no sense to try to compare them that way. By the way, in Africa AIDS kills more people than traffic accidents.


You mentioned Christine Maggiore and her husband as examples of healthy people with HIV:
Christine Maggiore gave birth to an H.I.V.-infected daughter, Eliza Jane, who acquired an AIDS-related infection and died at age 3.

Lots of people with HIV have been living very healthy lives, 15+ years or so after infection, even before the new retroviral therapies, without AZT. Doctors know that poz’s can, thru healthy choices, stave off the effects of the virus, though it is unclear for how long because some of these people eventually do get sick.


You mentioned the Padian study, one of the most often misunderstood by the AIDS conspiracy theorists. Here’s what Ms. Padian herself has to say about all this:

“In short, the evidence for the sexual transmission of HIV is well documented, conclusive, and based on the standard, uncontroversial methods and practices of medical science. Individuals who cite the 1997 Padian et al. publication (1) or data from other studies by our research group in an attempt to substantiate the myth that HIV is not transmitted sexually are ill informed, at best. Their misuse of these results is misleading, irresponsible, and potentially injurious to the public.
A common practice is to quote out of context a sentence from the Abstract of the 1997 paper: "Infectivity for HIV through heterosexual transmission is low". Anyone who takes the trouble to read and understand the paper should appreciate that it reports on a study of behavioral interventions such as those mentioned above: Specifically, discordant couples were strongly counseled to use condoms and practice safe sex (1,12). That we witnessed no HIV transmissions after the intervention documents the success of the interventions in preventing the sexual transmission of HIV. The sentence in the Abstract reflects this success -- nothing more, nothing less. Any attempt to refer to this or other of our publications and studies to bolster the fallacy that HIV is not transmitted heterosexually or homosexually is a gross misrepresentation of the facts and a travesty of the research that I have been involved in for more than a decade.”


Some of the AIDS conspiracy claims can be disproven by simply trying to reconcile what they say about AIDS with what has actually happened with the epidemic:

As far as the idea that the AIDS drugs themselves cause the disease - people are now living much longer than before, on average, with the new retroviral drug therapies than people who did not or do not have access to these therapies. There are thousands of people in Africa, sick with AIDS, who have never even seen an anti-retroviral drug or AZT as they are too poor to access decent medical treatment, so the drugs can't possibly be causing their illness. First the conspiracy theorists said it was AZT – early in the epidemic the higher dosages of AZT did cause problems for some people. Even so, however, studies still showed that AZT helped people.

Illegal drug use? Drug use does not cause the catastrophic immune system collapse that characterizes AIDS. There are people using drugs who do not have AIDS, and there are many people who have AIDS who do not use drugs. Drug use and unhealthy lifestyles had been around for many years before the discovery of HIV/AIDS, so why did the earlier drug-abusers not get sick with AIDS? Why did they only start getting sick with AIDS once the HIV virus showed up? NO study has EVER proven the causation of AIDS by illegal drug use, not one! It’s an interesting hypothesis, but simply not true. It also would not explain the disease in poor Africans. What does explain the disease in Africans is this: people with HIV develop AIDS, and people without HIV do not develop AIDS.


Some other people making money off of AIDS:
Some well-known AIDS conspiracy theorists, such as Rasnick and Rath, are now working for a multinational vitamin company that’s promoting vitamin therapy to cure AIDS. Who’s making money there?


More examples of how the AIDS conspiracy theorists are full of shit:

-There's a large and growing body of evidence that proto-oncogenes actually do contribute to some cancers; this contradicts Duesberg's earlier claims to the contrary.
-The conspiracy theorists claim that the HIV/AIDS connection does not satisfy Koch's postulates, even though it is clear that Koch's postulates are satisfied.
-Laboratory tests show HIV infecting the very same cells (the CD4 Lymphocytes) that are depleted in people who have AIDS.

Gos, if you're really the librarian you said you were, then I'm sure you won't have much trouble finding PLENTY of original sources for all of these, outside of virusmyth.com, that is . . .


And, in response to your #3:
“3) That I didn't do the very "different research, sorting out confusing and difficult data and competing explanations" that you say is the only way to know the truth. Can you prove to me that you HAVE done the required mental legwork, where I haven't? Can you prove to me that you even know half as much as I do about AIDS? You're awful quick to accuse someone else of intellectual laziness, but in your 10,000 word manifesto on "conspiracy theorists", you did not offer a single example of any claim I or any other AIDS dissident has ever made which has actually been disproven, though you claim that we dissidents have been extensively and consistently discredited. If this is so, WHAT has been disproven? Name one example, oh Great Master of Research.”

Clearly you haven't done the research because you've already mentioned a number of things in your own manifestos here that are either irrelevant, illogical, or completely wrong. You mentioned that Willner "never developed AIDS" - well he died of a heart attack before AIDS would have shown up! You tried to compare a disease epidemic to car crashes! Look, the information is out there, and it's obvious to anyone who is capable of thinking clearly and scientifically. You obviously have not done the research and mental legwork because you're only choosing to believe the limited resources that back up your points; you're ignoring the overwhelming body of evidence and scientific opinion about this topic. You brush off anything that contradicts what you think as some sort of conspiracy or mind control or some confluence of evil or unenlightened forces. You haven’t done the research because you still don’t see the one key scientifically unambiguously consistently proven fact: HIV causes AIDS! Maybe I won't convince you, maybe you're too brainwashed already, but hopefully the other people here will read this thread and will see what’s going on with the illogical claims of HIV-deniers.

And Gos, you said you’re HIV+. I sincerely hope that you never ever get sick with AIDS, and I hope that your girlfriend doesn’t either. I hope that you’re one of those lucky people who just keep living year after year without getting sick. I hope that if you do get sick you seek out the proper treatment. And I sure as hell hope that you don’t ever give this virus to anyone else!