The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

topic posted Wed, January 28, 2009 - 3:14 PM by  Unsubscribed
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Daath holds many things. Among them is the realization of what it means to ascend from this reality
to see the next higher emanation, from our perspective. On one side are the lower sephiroth, from
Chesed to Malkuth, and above the Abyss lie the Supernal Triangle, the three sephiroth of Kether,
Chokmah and Binah. Long have the Hebrews called the two sephiroth of Chokmah and Binah
Abba and Amma, Father and Mother. Does this refer to the Archetypal World, or the Material?

I believe this refers to the Material World. So, in a sense we have male and female. Also, for very
good reasons the kabbalists have insisted that the sephirah of Chokmah denoted the main
God-name. This is proper, in most senses. But also it has been related to me that they are together,
I would imagine on all planes of reality. So the difficulty we have is regarding them as being
conjoined, and not knowing why we espy the Tetragrammaton as the true unadulterated nature
of God. I rely on the idea of Chokmah as Force, unembodied, whereas Binah is Form.

So in a sense we imposed the fracture of the Abyss in order to stay in Malkuth.

As you rise in understanding of the sephiroth, many things are learned.

The main one I have to give you is that *you yourself* represent these gender fractures of God,
within the unique and individual form of humanity. Conjoined permanently with your love *of the
opposite sex* upon death, spirits intertwining, and you will reach Kether in Assiah, a stabilized
angelic form, a roaming star, able to move (I would think) at the speed of light around the universe,
while having and internal reality in which you and your love are separate and may experience physical
love. I know, dangerous idea, but why? So, *does* Kether of the lower reality mean the Malkuth of the higher?

This is pretty much the best thought studying the Kabbalah has ever given me.
I think this started for me because this world is near destruction, though the large
proportion of us never wanted that. I would blame no one, other than to say
throughout Biblical history we have had a premonition of the certainty of the end of the world,
even though it is not necessary. Perhaps because it happened before. I could draw that
picture for you. It's not pleasant. Why in some forms of the tree do we not have the
side re-inforcing Paths from Netzach to Malkuth and Hod to Malkuth? Why do they say
Malkuth is the most fragile world, even though it seems to be the most concrete in our
reasonings?

Offer in.
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  • Unsu...
     

    Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

    Wed, January 28, 2009 - 3:22 PM
    Track 11, David Bowie's 'A Better Future'

    www.youtube.com/watch
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      Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

      Thu, January 29, 2009 - 2:02 AM
      Note that the God-names on the two side pillars have either YHVH or Elohim,
      as in Elohim Gibbor for Geburah, or YHVH Tzevaoth for Netzach. Pillar of Severity
      having a combined face (Aleph Lamed; vowel, consonant), and Pillar of Mercy
      using the name commonly referred to as Jehovah. Working out the qualities
      of the Four Worlds is fun.
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        Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

        Thu, January 29, 2009 - 2:35 PM
        So how far up does Adam Kadmon go up the Tree? Their are various interpretations.
        One kabbalist vision even places a fifth world where there is a celestial man above it all.
        I personally think it's only here right at Malkuth. It's been said that the qliphoth fell below
        Yesod, and yes, all the unbalanced energy is right here. Why are there no aliens visiting
        us, no matter what the constraints of physical laws? Why do these supposed UFO's
        just flit around and leave no material evidence? Why is everyone sunk into paranoia?

        Also, whose belief is most fervent? I would say it's the belief of the Christians.
        What do they want upon 'the end of the world'? Judgment, the 'good' side getting
        some eternity of living in a 'perfect flesh', an immortality based upon what they experience
        here. Not a situation where souls are freed to wander the universe, but another
        'unity' in the flesh, inga man-god sacrificial lamb. Beliefs matter. Now Steven said
        God lifted us up out of the 'narrow place below Malkuth'. That's a good estimation,
        I guess. Why does the world reject rationality?

        So, 'Judgment'. A lack of forgiveness, causing, by their beliefs, the evil side of
        humanity to go to a fiery pit. To burn for all time. Isn't one of the qualities of
        Chokmah, at its most alchemical, the fires of creation. Is that what happens,
        a new emanation, the Malkuth of one reality disposed of to create another
        where those deemed evil in the last have to be the gods in the next, removed
        from those possessed of too much overweening worship? Who wants the flesh
        forever, the human flesh? Where is the escape route?
  • Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

    Thu, January 29, 2009 - 3:03 PM
    "Why in some forms of the tree do we not have the
    side re-inforcing Paths from Netzach to Malkuth and Hod to Malkuth?"

    From tribes.tribe.net/godcode/t...28d2627adc

    "I used to wonder why I've seen mainly two different types of Tree of Life constructs. One is the Luria construct which has Malchut attached to Yesod without connections to Hod and Netzach and the Cordevero construct which connect Malchut to all three. Leonora Leet cleared this up for me in her book “The Secret Doctrine of Kabblah” when she explained that the Luria tree depicts the Fall or post-breaking of the vessels from the inability of the construct to hold the full brilliant light.

    The Cordevero tree depicts the reconnection of Malchut to Hod and Netzach as a result of the "Great Work". Not sure if she used those words but that's how I read it. If we overlay the 10 Commandments to the Tree of Life, we can get some strong linkages to this theme. We know the 10th Commandment refers to coveting and not focusing on lack which the physical world tricks us into believing when we see others possesing things we don't have. The more we feel the lack the more we fall into an instinctual mode of behavior - especially with Yesod reflecting our shadow back to us. Yesod is related to the Moon and the letter Nun which I referenced above, as being the second letter in the Hebrew word Zanah which has been translated as fornication. Yesod is also referred to as the false self and directly relates to the 9th Commandment to not bear false witness. This is the act of deceiving ourselves into justifying our instinctual behavior as right and proper. It's kind of like denial for an addict where there is just no reasoning allowed for by the addict. There is nothing wrong in his or her opinion. Marriages can be lost, lives torn apart, and children hurt unnecessarily because the person is blinded to everything but what is desired. A vicious cycle occurs because pain and shame feed endlessly and is directly related to the disconnection from Hod which is Glory, and Netzach which is Victory.

    The 8th Commandment associated with Hod is thou shalt not steal. Steal what? How about the energy of others? Our own sexual energy has been blocked and as soon as we can unite with another's, we drink it up like a vampire. As soon we beome vampires, we spread it on with Netzach and it's associated commandment prohibiting adultry. The flowing energy that was severed in the Fall now has turned into adulterated energy of instinctual based exchanges everywhere, with everyone. This corrupts our sensibilities and keeps us further away from what we really seek which is the solar center of Beauty found in Tipheret, which is also the mediation point for the higher self found in the upper sephirot.

    Of course the 6th Commandment is: Donot Murder, which we've effectivelydone to ourselves by cutting off our solar center from the lower light which seeks to merge with the higher light. This then continues the endless cycle of pain and meaninglessness.

    Breaking through the instinctual self to the human self is the only way out. The ethical way is when we wake up to each other (and mainly to ourselves) to begin acting with integrity. The more we do this, the more the pathways to Hod, Netzach and Tipheret open up and our humanity born. IMO, this is the meaning of being born again. "
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      Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

      Thu, January 29, 2009 - 3:20 PM
      "The 8th Commandment associated with Hod is thou shalt not steal. Steal what? How about the energy of others? Our own sexual energy has been blocked and as soon as we can unite with another's, we drink it up like a vampire."

      Well, since Yesod is where sexual energy resides, and since this world is about conceiving more people
      to view God, so he can be happy, I would imagine that all the wasted energy of all the sephiroth might become
      sexual energy in some manner. Everyone has varying levels of sexual energy. We all are not born at the same
      level of virility or fecundity. Some imbalance is necessary, and may be based upon the degree to which people
      have been acting properly in possible previous lives. There is also the fact that most waste as much of their
      sexual energy throughout life in dalliances, mostly for pleasure, not creating children. Since we now have a
      bottleneck on this planet from a rational standard (too many people), and since we are rapidly destroying
      the sustainable nature on this planet, I see that as no problem. Perhaps it is only jealousy. To truly balance
      things out would take some eastern pujachakra, which no one wants, except those addicted to this form.

      Since the Moon is watery, and since in a scientific sense the moon only reflects a minute portion of
      the Sun's rays, most of which continue into space, I could relate this to a male's energies, which *always*
      outpace the females ability to create human life. There is simply no way that women could conceive
      a birth from every spermatozoa, and thank God for that rational fact.

      So if the Ten Commandments relate to the Vices of the Sephiroth, shouldn't we *ALL* be avoiding them?

      All of this bothers me not in the least, since I will *without doubt* give up the human form upon
      death, turning to better pastures.
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        Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

        Thu, January 29, 2009 - 3:29 PM
        To my mind, all the people being killed are trying to get us to produce babies so that
        they can have life here again, yet many of us know that we really don't need scads of
        new humans, since we are letting millions starve, and we don't even care, while our
        leaders squabble over control and ownership of the last heap of resources. We're
        destroying this planet rapidly, while some of the initial verses in the Bible say that
        we should be properly husbanding this world, not sucking it dry to have more pleasure.
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          Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

          Thu, January 29, 2009 - 3:30 PM
          So the main problem is the Vice of Geburah, Cruelty and Destruction, not fornication or adultry.
          The latter is just a ruse to not face what's really going on.
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      Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

      Sun, April 12, 2009 - 6:22 PM
      "The 8th Commandment associated with Hod is thou shalt not steal. Steal what? How about the energy of others? Our own sexual energy has been blocked and as soon as we can unite with another's, we drink it up like a vampire. As soon we beome vampires, we spread it on with Netzach and it's associated commandment prohibiting adultry. The flowing energy that was severed in the Fall now has turned into adulterated energy of instinctual based exchanges everywhere, with everyone. This corrupts our sensibilities and keeps us further away from what we really seek which is the solar center of Beauty found in Tipheret, which is also the mediation point for the higher self found in the upper sephirot."

      Why the adultery? Kings of Unbalanced Force, with harems. Many unloved women. How do they
      even that out? Think of Lilith. Are the Commandments truly kabbalistic? Perhaps. But both men
      and women have been too highly superficial for far too long. So we have an instance where if
      the supposedly "unnattractive" women were given mates, all this would fade away. Why are men
      driven to like "pretty" women? How many types of pretty women are there?

      So, too much emphasis on the sexual? Why would you think this is? Is it perhaps because
      Malkuth is below Yesod? Now, I've enjoyed looking at the other, non-Christian Trees. One of
      the most interesting things is the types of paths that cross Daath. In one you have Zayin - Yod
      going from Chokmah to Geburah. From Binah to Chesed you have Cheth -- Teth. Using the
      heiroglyphic/pictographic meaning supplied by Fortune in her book, I would label that as
      Sword/Hand, and Fence/Snake.

      All the same, do women need the energy of males? Do the feel more energetic after sex?
      Do men turn to warfare when prevailing ideas say that sex for anything other than procreation
      is wrong? Does the female of this species always get pregnant upon the initial act of sex?

      I guess people just like denying themselves and going to war, man to man, for sport.

      That's fine. I don't really care. Have it your way. Not like I want to change those ideas, really.
      We can go on judging each other sexually, all the while ignoring all the other problems that
      come from indulging in all the other vices of the sefirot.

      Where does this jealousy arise? I'm laughing...

      Those that suffer and perhaps don't over-indulge during one life go 'up' and accumulate more power,
      force, or whatever, **is one possibility**. Those that *do* over-indulge become addicted, take over,
      indulge in non-sexual forms of greed, and ever-progressively get trapped here. It's one possibility.
      Then they need those who escaped to come down and straighten them out. "My precious, my precious!"

      So dadgum it, whose been writing all the stuff that tells you all that you must repress even normal function?

      Weren't you talking about the sense of Love that we should be building? Not all of it needs be sexual, of course...


      A Jealous God... please!



      Murder would seem to be similar to the Vices of Geburah, Cruelty and Destruction. The Vice
      of Tifaret is Pride.
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        Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

        Sun, April 12, 2009 - 6:31 PM
        So I say we let those Fundamentalist Christians order up "one world destruction, please",
        so they can be physically raptured (to another planet! hot potato!), or even *somehow* make
        it into the real "waystation" nearest Heaven, then be sent back down here when the locals
        make more babies, that require souls. Because they like the form, of course.

        All because they are deathly afraid of dying. That's why the require the physical rapture.
        Don't wanna die?

        Why not? What are they afraid of? Coming back here? It's their damn theology, what,
        did we write it for them? Not our problem they believe it!

        I think I will be one of the snarling, many-headed Eastern bloodthristy olden gods with fangs
        that turns them back in fright.
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          Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

          Sun, April 12, 2009 - 6:37 PM
          So shall we say that the utter need to produce babies comes from Christian theology that insists
          that all souls wait here for the end of the world so that they can have the Last Judgment and a bodily
          resurrection? Is that the excuse? That despite the ego-driven idea that we experience only one life,
          we need to trap all those souls, without rebirth here or entrance into Heaven, in a Sheol/Hades like
          existence, in "caves" in the Earth?

          Or is it because the people in the nearest Heaven want another bodily life and temporary forgetfulness
          and thereby growth that another life promises?

          Or is it just because you all like to fuck? Seriously, what's the excuse?
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            Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

            Sun, April 12, 2009 - 6:38 PM
            LMAO LMAO LMAO LMAO LMAO LMAO LMAO!!!!!!!
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              Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

              Sun, April 12, 2009 - 6:40 PM
              Or did we only recently "build" Heaven... I'm sure it's just recently cobbled together.

              We would deny it as long as we could, I guess (some of us...)
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                Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

                Sun, April 12, 2009 - 7:19 PM
                Or we could say that no one has a soul, then there is no hell/SHeol/hades or heaven,
                and then you're going to have to depend on the Drake Equation and naturally-occuring
                life to have evolved enough by now and actually give enough of a shit to warp over here
                and give some lazy bums a kiddie ride in a space-mobile. I'd prefer you go put a quarter
                in the rocket ship machine in front of the local K-mart, myself.
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                  Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

                  Sun, April 12, 2009 - 10:33 PM
                  The last post was written because obviously some believe they only ever live one single life.
                  And then Heaven. But not. So Hell. But not. So where are they?

                  I would say living only one life, then the perpetual eternity in Heaven seems lopsided,
                  wouldn't you? Just as lopsided as staying here forever, until the world ends. And then
                  restarts. And ends again. And restarts. Why would one want to have a life here then?

                  Thinking..... processing...... I like reading literature. Music's mighty fine. Limitation is
                  enjoyable.
                  • This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.
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                    Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

                    Mon, April 13, 2009 - 1:52 PM
                    "I would say living only one life, then the perpetual eternity in Heaven seems lopsided,
                    wouldn't you?"

                    Of course there could be a time-differential, where the higher realms can experience
                    time at more epic lengths that the short lives here. Or even if reaching upwards enough
                    go backward in time, provided history is not changed. And really, you forget upon entering
                    the flesh again anyway. And you could be really unassuming. Or minorly pivotal.

                    I'd go have some fun at the battle at Thermopylae. Or go back and be a scribe in Uruk.
                    Or as always leave this planet and the human form entirely.
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                      Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

                      Mon, August 24, 2009 - 9:27 PM
                      Now, where on the Tree does Daath exist? By which I mean, where of the four worlds does Daath exist?

                      One indicator: Eloah Va Daath. Tiphareth in Atziluth. What does that mean? Does it have anything to do with The God-name Elohim placed at Binah in Atziluth? Where it has been said that Elohim is a feminine noun with a masculine plural. Isn't that the general thing that is said?

                      Daath isn't a sephirah, by most people's reasoning. It is the point between the Supernal Triad, and those below.

                      What is meant by 'separating the waters from the waters'? Is that the phrase used in the Torah/OT?

                      Is Daath the waters, or is Binah? Certainly Binah is spoken of as The Great Sea, but at which level?

                      I wonder sometimes if the whole process wasn't some type of multiple cascade effect. Happening at all levels at once.

                      But simply put, I don't think that since the Supernal Triad at Atziluth should be seen as self-cohesive, we should ascribe separation at that level. Yetzirah is said to be the World of Formation, or the 'Firmament'. In some initial formations of the Tree, the (possibly) Macrocosmic Yesod is the last sephirah in Yetzirah, prior to expanding this to four trees.
  • Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

    Thu, January 29, 2009 - 3:27 PM
    "Daath holds many things. Among them is the realization of what it means to ascend from this reality
    to see the next higher emanation, from our perspective."

    I equate Daat with Gnosis in that once we've accomplished the "Great Work' of integration I speak of in the previous post, a light bulb turns on which is Daat. It is paradoxical in its role as bottomless pit (abyss) of polarity/duality and in its unification of wisdom and understanding brought through the integration of these opposites.

    "Long have the Hebrews called the two sephiroth of Chokmah and Binah
    Abba and Amma, Father and Mother. Does this refer to the Archetypal World, or the Material?"

    Both imo. Archetype (As Above) Material (So Below). The projection of Archetype into mundane reality is not perfect therefore Adam is first created (Briah) as he and she together, then formed (Yetzirah) from the Clay of the earth (Malchut). Adam Kadmon is reclaiming the original template of Archetype imo, as we stretch back "up" through the same Worlds we came down from finding the inner female we disowned in the process.

    "So in a sense we imposed the fracture of the Abyss in order to stay in Malkuth"

    We chose duality so we could find unity. Just as God sought to see itself so we sought to see ourself - so we/God could know (gnosis) ourself.

    "So, *does* Kether of the lower reality mean the Malkuth of the higher?"

    I Am that I Am incorporates Kether's projection into Malchut and Malchut's reconnection with Kether imo. It is a mandala and an aspiration best represented in the notion of the Bride and the Bridegroom in Hebrew text and prayer with Shekinah/David playing out Malchut's desires for reunification imo.

    "I would blame no one, other than to say
    throughout Biblical history we have had a premonition of the certainty of the end of the world,"

    The end of a cycle is how I view it.
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      Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

      Thu, January 29, 2009 - 3:37 PM
      "The end of a cycle is how I view it."

      What's after the end of the cycle? Why do you view it that way?
      Why is there even any cycle?

      Back to the Bride and Bridegroom analogy? That is an appreciation
      very much lauded in Christianity. Way too human. I want to be something
      else. Way too much bullshit wrapped up in human understanding.
      Meaning, we are way too attached to this specific form, and refuse all others.

      Father and Mother are Material. The truest form of Binah is not a female human, and you know that.
      It's the *idea* of taking form. How constrained do we wish that to be?
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        Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

        Thu, January 29, 2009 - 3:47 PM
        So do most men want excess progeny, or are they just merely not careful enough to not
        produce an overplus? Do women want to be broodmares? I think having kids is somewhat
        painful for them. If you imagine the sephirah of Chokmah as male, and think that because of
        that God needs as many to be born just to mainly suffer here, I think you would be wrong.

        The Vice of Binah is Avarice (Greed). This can be seen many ways. One of which is for
        excess progeny. We all contain an aspect of Binah on our microcosmic trees. I say the world
        needs to stop giving into Greed in all its various interpretations.
      • Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

        Thu, January 29, 2009 - 3:55 PM
        "What's after the end of the cycle? Why do you view it that way?
        Why is there even any cycle?"

        It is the end of the cycle of exile. I suggest you read my book for a detailed explaination www.oracleofthephoenix.com

        "Back to the Bride and Bridegroom analogy? That is an appreciation
        very much lauded in Christianity. Way too human. I want to be something
        else. Way too much bullshit wrapped up in human understanding.
        Meaning, we are way too attached to this specific form, and refuse all others."

        Unity comes from "hearing" not seeing thus we are instructed to Hear Oh Israel that the Lord our God is One. Hearing means to listen..deeply intuitively..as in Prayer and Song in contemplation.

        en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lekhah_Dodi
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      Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

      Thu, January 29, 2009 - 4:10 PM
      "Adam Kadmon is reclaiming the original template of Archetype imo, as we stretch back "up" through the same Worlds we came down from finding the inner female we disowned in the process. "

      So once again, the rationale is that God is Human, even at the very highest levels.
      In my opinion, the Tree is just for humans.

      But anyway, you better help convince everyone to conserve all the sexual energy they can,
      (since we really don't need any more extra births), and this I feel will allow you to better
      understand what I'm saying. Of course this is just a belief, which I feel is propagated
      by the qliphotic side of Binah (at the lowest level), which wishes to have all of Chokmah's
      energy converted into new form, or sexual congress and pleasure. After all, the Inferior
      Mother is related to the Superior Mother, and they both share vices (Greed, Avarice), but
      traditionally the Inferior Mother (Malkuth) also has Inertia, which makes sense from the
      perspective that the most concrete reality would be hard to move or stimulate. And one
      of the Vices of Daath (Apathy) exists at its most fierce *right here*. Every sephirah contains
      every other sephirah, and their are lessons to be learned by understanding Daath in
      each of the sephiroth on the Tree.
      • Unsu...
         

        Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

        Thu, January 29, 2009 - 4:14 PM
        In saying that the Tree is just for humans, I meant that the limitations imposed here
        are not the same truth as arise at higher levels. All of this information is for humans.
        No alien is on some distant world light years away studying the Kabbalah. They would
        have their own entirely unique system predicated upon their own unique form.
        There are not just humans spread everywhere throughout the entire universe.
        That's completely ridiculous. And even the most basic and conservative estimation
        of the factors in the Drake Equation would tell us that the universe is veritably teeming
        with life, if not a huge amount of galactic civilizations. We don't know yet, and we should not assume.
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          Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

          Thu, January 29, 2009 - 4:47 PM
          As far as I'm concerned, the Kabbalah and the Tree reflect man in its grosser ideas,
          but in its more finer ideas reflect what is above us. Some Adam Kadmon *is* restricted
          in separate, gendered selves solely at this level. Could you imagine being a point of light,
          male and female from this world combined, mixing and communicating with other such
          points of light at the next highest level, being told that they had come from other totally alien
          worlds, having enjoyed totally alien bodies, and the "two" of your sharing those completely
          different perspectives, while you fly about viewing this reality and others? That's where I
          want to be, limiting or restricting the desires to that which is within, and not letting it rampage
          about. So I say again, *why not* view the Supernal Triad as being a Trinity unto itself?
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        Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

        Thu, January 29, 2009 - 4:17 PM
        Steven, parts of what you state are amply proving to me that One: you are addicted to human
        form, if only mentally (study some hard science) and Two: that you prefer a cyclic reality (more
        limitation), which I feel is an aspect of Binah, minus the straight line of Chokmah. A Shell without
        its Point.
        • Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

          Thu, January 29, 2009 - 4:44 PM
          And Crusty you are amply proving to me that you are lost in a world of abstractions.

          The Tree of Life can be whatever you want it to be - it's a model at both a micro level and a macro level. It is fractal ..self-replicative from a grain of sand to a universe. If you want to impose it upon theories of population control and vices..feel free. I just share from my own perspective - a spiritual one concerning the work of Tikkun Olam. It seems to me that part of that work is moving from a linear mindset to an intuitive one (circle).

          We are talking apples and oranges here imo. You propose an apple and I answer with an orange. I guess I'll refrain from continued participation.
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            Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

            Thu, January 29, 2009 - 4:53 PM
            Are the Vices and the Ten Commandments pretty much saying the same things?
            Which perspective is the more detailed one?

            "It seems to me that part of that work is moving from a linear mindset to an intuitive one (circle)."

            How about an ascending spiral in place of both of those outlooks?

            Population *must* be controlled. It is tremendously foolish to do otherwise.
            We are wreaking havoc on this world. Climate Change, the near-death of the oceans,
            the extinction of so many species, we are the ones causing this, it is incontrovertible.

            Why would you want to refrain from continued participation? What is their to fear?

            I would rather have some abstractions than be trapped here forever.

            If maleness is activity and potency, then to "balance out the sexual energies"
            would require the loss of all what was gained by many suffering at the hands of others,
            all that was gained by ascetics throughout the ages. Just so everyone could
            start out again with the same energy, a leveling of the playing field. It won't happen.
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              Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

              Thu, January 29, 2009 - 5:02 PM
              I simply won't go in a circle. I demand progress. Adam Kadmon is not merely male,
              it is supposed to be male and female combined. Which in some kabbalistic tracts
              means that he could move through this dense matter of Malkuth like a spirit, nothing
              inhibiting his progress.

              On another point: I haven't researched it completely, but if the Hebrew spelling of Eheieh
              is akin to AHIH, then you have Aleph at Kether before those remaining letters, whereas you
              have IHVH beginning with Yod, which is the Tenth Letter (10). If you consider 1 as the active
              idea, and 0 as the passive, you will get my point. And so in a sense Aleph could be considered
              the 1 without the 0, meaning the sephirah of Chokmah, which would be akin to the Chiah
              in the Archetypal world, Atziluth; above the Neschamah, above the Ruach, above the Nephesch.
            • Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

              Thu, January 29, 2009 - 5:59 PM
              "I would rather have some abstractions than be trapped here forever."

              It's the Tree of Life, not the Tree of Escape.

              Adam Kadmon is male and female - he is the first Adam mentioned in Genesis "He God created Them - Male and Female".

              Ayeh is spelled Aleph- Hey - Yud - Hey. The Ten Commandments is about much more than vices - See the last part in the Keys of Enoch and you can really go crazy with your abstractions.

              www.keysofenoch.org/html/overview.html
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                Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

                Thu, January 29, 2009 - 7:09 PM
                Male and Female are terms solely concerned with the type of life on this planet.
                Science fiction is full of all sorts of speculation as to other possible means to
                procreate that could, in some form, be occuring on other planets in other solar
                systems.

                Now, Yesod as Steven has said main in some regard mean sexual energy,
                the active portion of which is male in human relations. He's even stated that
                'Sod' in Hebrew means secret. And the name of the sephirah begins with a Yod,
                which can mean either 'hand' or phallus/lingam (on the lower order), but if one
                looks at the Moon association, on sees a watery aspect, related to Binah in a sense
                (Mara, The Great Sea), but in truth the sephirah of the Sun is Tiphareth, not Yesod,
                so Yesod is borrowing from above, and if one looks at the Tarot cards one sees
                Temperance between those two, and the Astrological sign assigned to that card is
                Sagittarius (Mutable Fire), associated with the Hebrew Letter Samekh, which is called
                the "Prop connecting Microprosopus with His Foundation. Foundation is one of the
                meanigs of the Hebrew word Yesod. Now, the 25th Path (which that is) is called the
                "Intelligence of Probation.... and is so called because it is the primary temptation,
                by which the Creator trieth all righteous persons".

                Now, I am not too concerned, as I said. It's not about the physical, it's about the spiritual,
                and it is better not to judge each other over the actions of the body. If were could give up
                judgment, and let God judge, we would be able to be far more pleasant to one another.
                And I feel that in essence the Christians have fell into a situation where they 'vampirically',
                as Steven stated, live upon some other person's body, insisting that they live in extremes,
                when they themselves do not, sexually. Moderation, please. The Middle Pillar. Kindness, mildness.
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                Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

                Thu, January 29, 2009 - 10:05 PM
                "It's the Tree of Life, not the Tree of Escape."

                I'm considering it the Tree of Escape back into Yetzirah.

                Sometimes the ideas surrounding the Ayin, En Sof, and Or En Sof become
                limiting when applied to the Tree. We need to see the depths of the Tree in
                a more intricate fashion.

                Strangely enough one could consider that the three of those could be termed reflections
                of the supernal triad: Or En Sof for Kether (Limitlessness), En Sof for Chockmah
                (Limitless Light), and Ayin (Negativity) for Binah.
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                  Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

                  Fri, January 30, 2009 - 7:22 PM
                  Ishim (Ashim), Aleph Shin Yod Mem(In Hebrew "people"):

                  "In Cabalistic theory, the tenth host of angels, consisting of the souls of righteous human beings.
                  The Ishim correspond to the Sephirah Malkuth in the world of Yetzirah.

                  Said to be composed of snow and fire, these angels are the forces which hold the atomic particles
                  of physical matter together. Some consider the Ishim to be of human rather than angelic origin."
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    Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

    Thu, January 29, 2009 - 6:56 PM
    As to this: "Conjoined permanently with your love *of the opposite sex*"

    I don't think it really matters whether your love is male or female or whether
    you are homosexual or not, it's the non-physical love which is important,
    and since everyone has a microcosmic Binah on their Tree, it could be
    that over-receptiveness might be causing homosexuality in some spiritual
    manner, but in whatever case I do not care, I will not judge, since I do not
    need to solely focus on the physical, and insist on not being prejudicial
    about human problems when we all are causing them to be perpetuated.
  • Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

    Sat, February 14, 2009 - 11:03 AM
    Reading through all these seems to get very mixed up. But as far as my understanding goes the tree of life can be shown to represent many aspects of life the universe and everything. and that DAATH is not really a sephiroth and known as the Abyss is because when a soul finally gets fed up with ist paths and many lifetimes in Hindu and Budhism is the same..... it is said to go on the Great Search and in the Kabbala this is known as The Great Work, in doing so it may seek knowledge everywhere, and become lost, and also begin to let go of doctrine and dogma BUT search for its own experiential TRUTH.

    Crossing Daath therfore becomes the abyss, many get lost or give up, some fall on stoney ground, but for the real Seeker after Truth they will find that Truth, each the same but in their own unique way. But first we may have to let go of beliefs, and let go of known to go out into the unknown. This is the Abyss, But you will find it for all it takes is Perseverence. and those old but good things called trust and faith.

    Malkult is the physicAL world, and sometimes owver Malkuth is seen a Rainbow for it is the gateway to higher things and Truth, Yesod is 5th dimension from which we fell, in Adams fall, for here we were guided so that we would be ready for a physical life.

    The 5th dimension is where we may visit in our dreams or visions, and is sometimes known as "the little heaven" because our glimpses, may lead us to believe we have 'arrived'. It is in these three higher sephiroth that the magical triangle is touched on and many get stuck here too. As B|udha says neti neti not this not this yet! Or Gate' gate' Beyond Beyond.

    But once you leave malkult, you are beginning a journey and can communicate with gUARDIANS, guides, in Yesod the Astral dimension. You go there every night in 'dreams'. It is like this one and vast, it is where shamans have their visions, as some American Indian call Walking in the SKy. Aborigini's call the 'Dreamtime'. This is why so many stories show Labarynths and the hero getting distracted from his path, or lost in the woods. These can be the dark nights of the soul, and often we reach up and get knocked back down again.

    From the great 1 and the big bang the universe unfolded, Keter, to Binah so from the Holy divine Father the Great Mother opened up a great space or womb for the universe to take place in. In Raj Yoga this is the dark universe and there is another entirely of light. Beyond Beyond.

    Male and Female matter very much - yin Yang, Light Dark. For this is what we must contend with and reconcile, in order to return and become whole. On the tree of life you have the Black Pillar and the White, So the qualities of male and Female need bee balanced, the middle path or the middle Pillar. If you think of them as energies it gets easier. The Divine Father that guide with wisdome and the Divine Mother that has compassion. Intuition balanced with intellect. Feelings and Thoughts. Honouring our Mother and Father, we become Whole or Holy. The child.

    So get climbing that tree!
  • Re: The Reason For The Abyss And Daath

    Sat, April 25, 2009 - 11:16 AM
    For ME the idea or the statement “Crossing the Abyss” refers more to a process than a place- however when one is in the process of changing ones way of receiving ( receiving data, perceptions- ones view of reality- or ones ACCEPTANCE of receiving Reality) then it can and does feel like you are in a place- or a void.
    - Being in a void- is where one is constanly attempting to AVOID the obvious aspects of reality. We, as magiains- when approaching the process of “crossing the abyss” begin to shed our childish ( not chilkike or chilhood) ways of appreciating reality. This is almost always a painful process- unless you can claim that your upbringing was “perfect” ( and I would not beleive you). Even if you had no real Trauma as a child or young adult- the very pressure and fact of being alive should be enough to throw anyone into Trauma. Trauma and Fear are key elements in the growth of anything, be it a person, plant or planet.
    - One can understand the term “Crossing the Abyss” in other ways just by looking at the Tree of Life- and seeing where DAATH is situated. Of course you will not be able to understand DAATH unless you understand what surrounds it- and the imaginary linear time of Initiation through each Sphere and Path.
    - DAATH "seems" a Secret door in which The Tree of Life is "inverted,"

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