No to group moderator

topic posted Thu, June 11, 2009 - 12:43 AM by  karolina
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I have now given this matter 10 minutes of thought while looking at this council page thing.

And I am strongly against this group moderation; I am most against the built-in hierarchy that it creates.

No matter what 'best of intentions' with which this group starts, it still means "they" will be having secret decoder ring meetings deciding what is acceptable and what is not while the rest of this tribe is excluded from that process. The exclusion process results from hierarchy, without any one in particular having to take personal responsibility for moderating decisions, except anonymous. This group will be having all the power without the personal individual responsibility vital to the positon of moderator. That is wrong.

Since we must have a moderator, let it then be a single individual personally answerable to all of this tribe.
posted by:
karolina
Vancouver
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  • auX
    auX
    offline 0

    Re: No to group moderator

    Thu, June 11, 2009 - 1:31 AM
    karolina,
    both ways of moderating, individual or group have the potential for
    abuse of power.
    from what I have understood, we must have a moderator,
    so the quesiton is which way to go?
    I cant imagine anybody as bad as nathan for moderator,
    but then who knows and to have to go through what we just went through
    to claim back this space is an unpleasant task,
    so how to maintain the balance here?
    I dont know.
    aD
    • Re: No to group moderator

      Thu, June 11, 2009 - 2:03 AM
      Of course any kind of moderating has the potential for abuse of power. You have missed my point aD. My main point is accountability. Or rather the lack thereof if this tribe is moderated by a council.

      K
      • Re: No to group moderator

        Thu, June 11, 2009 - 2:36 AM
        Besides it is easier to get rid of one individual than getting rid of a ‘council’. An individual has direct accountability to this tribe. A council only has group aka anonymous accountability. That means none. “Councils’ skip process because they by-pass personal individual accountability, and that is not RUOW.
      • auX
        auX
        offline 0

        No to group moderator

        Thu, June 11, 2009 - 2:37 AM
        karolina,
        lack of accountability creates abuse of power.
        an individual as moderator does not create accountability.
        the virtual tribe itself does not set up system in insure accountabilty,
        therefore I assume that the person who is the moderator has their
        own internal system to create accountability,
        which as we just experienced is not the case,
        even in this right use of will world,
        a reason to over-ride others was created by the moderator,
        and that person was accountable to their own internal system.
        for me I see no way out of this dilemma.
        art imitating life.
        aD

        • Re: No to group moderator

          Thu, June 11, 2009 - 7:30 AM
          I'm still in favor of a group moderator, despite the appearance of lack of accountability. I don't know how this is going to be set-up, but its worth a try.

          But I would be open to at least 5 members here agreeing to have just one moderator.

          W.L.
          • Re: No to group moderator

            Thu, June 11, 2009 - 10:45 AM
            Why dont You just let me be the moderator, if you just need a body and a name ....
            I have NO idea how to work the dials to kick anybody off, and with me, the more anarchist RAGE the better.

            Haveing me as a "moderator," is the next best thing to haveing no moderator at all cause # 1, i dont know how to do it and #2, I am way too lazy to learn how to kick anybody out.
            • Re: No to group moderator

              Thu, June 11, 2009 - 12:22 PM
              Karolina, we can form this whatever way we want to. My idea about a council, is that there has to be an agreement in place that requires discussion between the group and those moderating before ANY action can be taken. The point of this is not to take power out of the groups hands, but to empower the group to discuss everything, together.

              This means that, deciding anything may take longer because we need to run everything by the group as a whole.

              And btw, there are soooo many lookyloos in this tribe, people who have NEVER opened their mouths to say anything at all about anything. As far as I can tell, the only people here who give a shit are the ones having this discussion right now. There is so much fear here of saying anything or having unloving light turned on them, that this tribe has felt abandoned, except for the uncanny feeling that everything I say and do is being WATCHED by anonymous eyes. I find this to be extremely creepy.
              • Re: No to group moderator

                Thu, June 11, 2009 - 12:47 PM
                Daisy, I for one KNOW that individuals need not ever open their mouths in order to participate. I am sure when you think about it, you also realize this. Lookyloos are everywhere, not just here. I rarely participate because I get impatient with most of what is posted. As I have already said elsewhere, I find it pointless to read past the first load of crap.

                I went and looked at that council link and that creeped me out WAY MORE for the reasons I have already given on this thread. And for which I feel my concerns have remained unaddressed. But that is not your problem alone, as usual the majority will do as it pleases.... eventually.
                • Re: No to group moderator

                  Thu, June 11, 2009 - 12:53 PM
                  "Daisy, I for one KNOW that individuals need not ever open their mouths in order to participate. I am sure when you think about it, you also realize this."

                  I disagree. Why belong to a discussion forum if you aren't going to say anything? Ever? I mean, I'm sure that people are moving with what comes up, but I could also say that they aren't. Either way, I don't really care, I just dislike having a sense of being "watched". It's creepy. It feels dishonest somehow, like fear is being indulged but not moved. It's difficult for me to articulate the wrongness I feel, but I feel it and I'm gonna express it and go with it for a while to see where it takes me.
                  • This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.

                    Re: No to group moderator

                    Thu, June 11, 2009 - 12:56 PM
                    I would ask that the members here SAY that they are here at least, just to acknowledge their own presence to the rest of us.

                    I like the feeling of having witnesses when I need it or want it, but sometimes it doesn't feel like witnessing. It feels vampiric or parasitic.
                    • Re: No to group moderator

                      Thu, June 11, 2009 - 1:35 PM
                      I agree that other members here should make their presence known from time to time. Perhaps a thread should be opened for that purpose.

                      God knows, I am no spokesperson or apologist for any silent majority, but my own personal feeling tells me that the majority of members are here for the same main reason I am; to know I am not alone in this perverse twisted healing process. So that's why most of the time the things that are expressed here are to me besides the point, most of the time I just don't care. But I do care that I am not alone.
                      • Re: No to group moderator

                        Thu, June 11, 2009 - 1:36 PM
                        Me too, Karolina. Point taken. :)
                        • Re: No to group moderator

                          Thu, June 11, 2009 - 1:41 PM
                          The way it feels....is......what I give is being taken and nothing is offered. I realize that this is a feeling and may not necessarily reflect the truth. Partially, I feel like I am giving a guilt reflection to those that are holding guilt about this. I don't mean to guilt anyone, but I am feeling that familiar feeling of someone else's emotional reality clumping around my head because I am willing to express it. I don't really think that folks are 'wrong', per-say, I just want to know who is here and who isn't.
                      • Re: No to group moderator

                        Thu, June 11, 2009 - 1:42 PM
                        And Karolina, I want to tell you that your response to
                        me feels really really good. So good. I'm glad you are here.
                        • Re: No to group moderator

                          Thu, June 11, 2009 - 2:57 PM
                          I think a thread should be open for the purpose of others making their presence known, either through their expression or perhaps the presence of their avatar or photo. After I give some thought as to how it would feel best to do that with a minimum of denial, I may do that, or perhaps someone else will. But right now the sun is shining.

                          I would like to point out that there seems to be so much individual posting because there is no moderator here.
                          My point about that is I like to control my own thread without anyone else at all moderating it.. That is why I opened it. And I think that is the way it should be kept. The individual that has opened a thread retains control over it, no matter who is 'moderating' this tribe.

                          That is not to say that the individual actually has total control over their personal thread in any case. All threads are subject to hijacking or reposting etc. But at least the thread originator has majority influence on the energetic level, and that is what feels good to me.
                          • Re: No to group moderator

                            Thu, June 11, 2009 - 3:56 PM
                            Hi Karolina, I am also WAY glad to see You here

                            You have no worrie with me jacking with threads, i have no idea how to do it, fact is, i have no idea what you are even talking about here, but i like the steady rythm patter of Your speech

                            i am deeply involved with some disputes with the friggen chickasaw elders.....WHAT a bunch of Mother hateing bozoos !

                            Oklahoma needs to get a clue !
                          • Re: No to group moderator

                            Sat, June 13, 2009 - 1:45 PM
                            I am not sure to whom the 'victim victim' thread is intended, but I am staying off of that thread directly out of respect for the hurt expressed there and responding for my part of it from this thread here.
                            But since I did use that phrase, victim, on the 'not liking what's going on' thread, I would like to say I used that word in full consciousness of my own experiences as major victim and perpetrator.

                            Now I am going outside.
  • Unsu...
     

    Re: No to group moderator

    Sat, June 13, 2009 - 6:06 PM
    ha ha. karolina. I know we've had our differences, but.I have to say I am actually starting to appreciate your unabashed sass. "secret decoder ring meetings".... that's f'n great... couldn't have said it better.... also thought the bit you said about to Rae in the other thread about how things get derailed, stuck in complaints was spot on and have wanted to make the same point my self so many times, but never found the words... If my moderating was holding back your input, then I guess it eithe rwas not righ tplace or not right time. anyway, well said and i concur.

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