This seems like the best place to post this, I'm hoping for some insight and a bit of "yeah, I've seen that too."
I've got a member of my coven who has been with us for a little over five years. She is a First Degree Priestess (we have 3 degrees). She performs the role that the Farrars defined as the Maiden - she's like a right hand person for me to help me handle logistics and getting things organized for the other 8 people.
Recently (within the past six months) she's started getting confrontational with me, bitchy, and taking even the slightest things I say personally. Now, I've known her for some time, so I continually ask her "Are you allright? ", "Did I do something to upset you?", "Do you want to talk to me about something?" and I continually get "No, I'm fine." Which, based on her behavior, doesn't seem to be true.
I have run the gauntlet on trying different things to work through this confrontational tone she's taken: I've talked to her long term boyfriend to find out if there is anything bothering her -- nothing major. I've talked to other long-term coven members to find out if she's said anything to them -- nothing. I've given her larger roles in rituals thinking she may feel under-appreciated. I've given her a larger vote in some thing that she invests alot of time and energy into. Nothing seems to change her tone.
So now I ask you all: when you were first working in your "teaching coven\circle", and you started to feel the pull to higher degrees, did you get crabby and thin skinned? I ask because I did, but I don't have anyone else in my network of friends and aquaintances who has taken a leadership role in a magickal group. Between 2nd and 3rd degrees I felt like everything that my HPS said to me was a personal attack. Now, looking back through those emails and remembering our conversations, she was trying very hard to connect with me and be loving and the thin-skinned reactions were a result of my being pushed to face some very deep-seated fears and apprehensions that I didn't even know I had.
What are your thoughts?
What are some energetic or magickal exercises that I can try to help work the energies through in this scenario? If any?
I've offered to organize and lead rituals just for senior members to ensure that they are ALL getting the magickal experiences that they want in the coven.. and in those rituals she's happy and friendly with everyone. But days afterwards she's grumpy and biting again.
Thank you for any insight and input!
Blessings,
IxChel
I've got a member of my coven who has been with us for a little over five years. She is a First Degree Priestess (we have 3 degrees). She performs the role that the Farrars defined as the Maiden - she's like a right hand person for me to help me handle logistics and getting things organized for the other 8 people.
Recently (within the past six months) she's started getting confrontational with me, bitchy, and taking even the slightest things I say personally. Now, I've known her for some time, so I continually ask her "Are you allright? ", "Did I do something to upset you?", "Do you want to talk to me about something?" and I continually get "No, I'm fine." Which, based on her behavior, doesn't seem to be true.
I have run the gauntlet on trying different things to work through this confrontational tone she's taken: I've talked to her long term boyfriend to find out if there is anything bothering her -- nothing major. I've talked to other long-term coven members to find out if she's said anything to them -- nothing. I've given her larger roles in rituals thinking she may feel under-appreciated. I've given her a larger vote in some thing that she invests alot of time and energy into. Nothing seems to change her tone.
So now I ask you all: when you were first working in your "teaching coven\circle", and you started to feel the pull to higher degrees, did you get crabby and thin skinned? I ask because I did, but I don't have anyone else in my network of friends and aquaintances who has taken a leadership role in a magickal group. Between 2nd and 3rd degrees I felt like everything that my HPS said to me was a personal attack. Now, looking back through those emails and remembering our conversations, she was trying very hard to connect with me and be loving and the thin-skinned reactions were a result of my being pushed to face some very deep-seated fears and apprehensions that I didn't even know I had.
What are your thoughts?
What are some energetic or magickal exercises that I can try to help work the energies through in this scenario? If any?
I've offered to organize and lead rituals just for senior members to ensure that they are ALL getting the magickal experiences that they want in the coven.. and in those rituals she's happy and friendly with everyone. But days afterwards she's grumpy and biting again.
Thank you for any insight and input!
Blessings,
IxChel
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Re: The five year itch - Sr. Coven members
Wed, August 2, 2006 - 10:23 AMIn my experience, people that are not self-aware enough of what they are going through and how it is affecting them won't be able to tell anything is wrong. Especially when their fears are being tapped into.
Speaking for my own experiences, the only parallel I can draw ('cause perhaps I have selective memory or am not being self-aware enough!), is it took me forever to figure out I had a huge hormone imballance... the more I got called on my bitchy behavior, the more I was able to identify it myself... how I made the connection of, I'm having too many mood swings maybe I should call my doctor, I don't recall!
Have you tried the approach of telling her how you feel when this happens and what it is you need from her (in terms of her behavior/atttitude)? Using all the non-confrontational language, and all that good stuff.
Namaste,
Jennifer
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Re: The five year itch - Sr. Coven members
Sat, August 5, 2006 - 2:09 AMJust curious - has your group done any shadow work? -
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Re: The five year itch - Sr. Coven members
Mon, September 18, 2006 - 2:35 PMOk.. I'm just checking in on this now because between the beginning of August and now I've been dealing with so much drama!! *aaa*
Yes, we do shadow work in cycles at Dark Moon, we also teach different shadow rituals or exercises that involve using music, drawing, and other non-verbal tools to represent where we are right now.
thank you for the input.. it helps!!
~ixChel
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Re: The five year itch - Sr. Coven members
Mon, August 7, 2006 - 7:19 AMHello,
Great question....my experience has been that when working within a degree system, there are definite "things" people go through at definite (and not so definite) times.
As an HPS, it is my responsibility to notice these shifts, though sometimes they are subtle, but it is NOT my job to chase that person down and tell them what is wrong with them. At certain stages of the game, I will give appropriate homeworks, counsels, etc...in hopes that they will get the guided message.
However, I do need to take care of myself. So, perhaps you want to confront her on what is making you uncomfortable, OR...you may want to look at why it is making YOU uncomfortable, and take a lesson for yourself. Be warry of Gossip and talking to others about it.
Blessings
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Re: The five year itch - Sr. Coven members
Thu, August 10, 2006 - 1:11 PMThe advise already given is great.
I am also a HPS and I take a level of responsibility on when our coven iniates its members, we also give each one a private teacher. The private teachers job is to ensure the student gets what the need, as you know not, maybe, what they want, so I have a question it is, Is this member your student? The teacher will impart information as to when a student is getting ready for a new degree.
I encourage my coven members to write and perform coven rituals, this I have always done for many reasons but one is, it gives the members the chance of a smooth enterance into their degrees.
Five years if I understand correctly is a long time in one position in a coven. It is a very demanding job, and can become boring. I try not to have a member in one position for more than a year and a day. Unless they request it, and it makes sense for them.
In my tradition the Handmaiden is my second in command and a second degree is well suited for this position, or a first who is preparing for their second.
I find I decide little in my coven, the coven works in a democratic manner. I follow the laws of my tradition and this is the result. I have veto power and I have not had to use it yet. -
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Re: The five year itch - Sr. Coven members
Mon, September 18, 2006 - 2:44 PMZena you mentioned that you only keep members in certain roles for a year.. I think that is a great idea. I had been taught differently but I'm seeing now that it's not going to work as well as rotating them may work.
I've got a maiden role that gets filled, and a ritualist (who writes and helps write rituals with others), and a mediator (gentle person who eases conflicts with others really well). What other roles do you have in your group? As a side note, everyone in my coven teaches and is encouraged to teach at least two classes a year to the rest of the coven on a topic that they know or love to study. So I tend to give them room to fill that role however they wish to..
I'd love to have a series of specialists in different work and then rotate people through them, but I worry about forcing someone into a role that they may not fill with great passion or energy because they just don't click with the work. maybe that is a candidate for the "challenge builds character" rule?
Thank you for your input,
Ixchel
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Re: The five year itch - Sr. Coven members
Mon, September 18, 2006 - 2:40 PMRight on!! yes.. no chasing. *sigh*
But we managed to get through her bitchy spell, and get an apology.. only to have her ask to begin the work for 2nd degree --- so let's count, how many HPSs on this list were right?? *laugh* Oh, ALL of them!!
I did sit her down, tell her how her behavior made me feel.. honor my feelings as gently as I could while listening.
my main challenge with this particular woman is that she's REALLY energetic and contributes alot on one level, but is out of balance and this balancing issue is what triggers these bitchy spells. So it is a kind - of Five Year Itch thing... which manifests differently in other people ( and probably different in other groups) but with her and in this group she gets really bossy, bitchy, and rude about her opinion.
I usually DO give students\young clergy things to be responsible for.. challenges that they need to work on. With this one, however, she just refuses to do some of the work (inner work, dealing with her own judgement of herself and such) and chooses to do other work (putting together schedules, classes, etc) and I'm being pushed to a point where some of the responsibilities that she's worked hard to earn are going to have to be given to someone else until she accepts that she's not being someone who is nurturing the coven but draining it with her control issues.
Oy.. Can I get paid for this job? *laughter*
Thank you for your input, my friend.. this was awesome!
~ixChel -
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Re: The five year itch - Sr. Coven members
Tue, September 19, 2006 - 10:55 AMThank you for initiating this thread ... it reminds me I'm not alone in dealing with issues such as these! And I get to read about how others deal with group structure, communication, cooperation, conflict resolution...
Even if I could get a dollar for every time I've asked if I can get paid for this job, I'd be rich! ;-)
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Re: The five year itch - Sr. Coven members
Wed, February 21, 2007 - 3:07 AMif i may. One must remember that the world is imperfect, duplicitous, dichotomous. When on the path of sensing energies you become more and more sensitive. When 2 ultra sensitive peoples energies meet, small differences can become great. Have you considered that maybe you just don't like each other? Try admitting dislike and realize its inevitability, and attempt to keep a professional attitude. if you come to this agreement you may find you get along much better. Thanks for listening. Blessed be.
