Has anybody else noticed that tribe members seem to be dropping?? Even in some of my most popular tribes I've noticed the members list declining. Is TOU cleaning house on all the unactive profiles? Or do you think we are losing people from tribe all together?
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Re: Tribe members declining
Thu, February 14, 2008 - 12:31 PMCould be some of the longstanding bugs are finally driving people away.
It might help if the absentee landlords put in an appearance. Darren is being asked to handle way too much.
IMHO.
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Re: Tribe members declining
Thu, February 14, 2008 - 12:40 PMThe star thing might be bad.
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Re: Tribe members declining
Thu, February 14, 2008 - 12:40 PMI agree completely Craig, he is only one man... he can't possibly do it all. But can somebody explain to me again why they haven't hired anybody else? Wasn't that the plan in the begining??
I don't want tribe to fall... I hope they can do something fast!! -
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Re: Tribe members declining
Thu, February 14, 2008 - 12:43 PMSorry Loki.. we must have posted at the same time, I meant for that to be above yours
But your comment is intresting... Do you really think that could be the problem? Premium membership is scaring folks away, or maybe they feel threatend by star owners? -
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Re: Tribe members declining
Thu, February 14, 2008 - 7:34 PM>>Do you really think that could be the problem?<<
Well, if it were me, for the first time, I'd be like "Oh I see how it is." I support the star program, more or less. Just brainstorming.
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Re: Tribe members declining
Thu, February 14, 2008 - 12:47 PMMy wildass guess is that he is doing a fair amount of this on speculation, and the reason Wendy is scarce is that she has to work another gig to pay the bills. Something like this is not cheap to maintain, and as long as they keep looking for help in the Bay Area they're not going to be able to afford it.
Again, this is just guessing, but there really aren't that many scenarios to play out.
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Re: Tribe members declining
Thu, February 14, 2008 - 1:10 PMmaybe people are just doing early spring cleaning of their tribes and leaving ones they aren't active in. i am loathe to read too much into it. -
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Re: Tribe members declining
Thu, February 14, 2008 - 2:09 PMIronically, I just did some cleaning of my own a few days ago. I dropped a bunch of tribes that I really hadn't been bothering with, or those that had been bothering me. Seriously, I dropped about half of my list. I guess it's almost like real-life. You meet someone, say hello, have a conversation or two, then you decide you just aren't interested and go looking for new friends.
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Re: Tribe members declining
Thu, February 14, 2008 - 7:35 PM>>as long as they keep looking for help in the Bay Area they're not going to be able to afford it.<<
Hey, that's a point, too: SF is overpriced like gangbusters.
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Re: Tribe members declining
Thu, February 14, 2008 - 8:41 PMI both bookmark and join a tribe, when I join it. I have many other tribes bookmarked that I read-only. Sometimes I will join a tribe ONLY for a specific discussion and then leave it when the discussion dies down. But it IS kept bookmarked for quite some time. Some are of interest to read, but I don't know enough to participate.
I think that many other people join all the tribes they have even a little bit of interest in, and suddenly realize they have a few hundred tribes, only problem is, they really participate in a handful. It can make a person feel like they are "falling behind" if they go to their tribes and have so many unread posts. They aren't going to read them all. I certainly don't read all the posts that number over 1,000 in Politics. No way. I just scan it once in awhile.
I might leave a tribe if there are problems. Or join it when there are problems, because I have something to say about whatever is going on.
There are many very slow tribes, that i have bookmarked or have joined, that do not need instant or daily reading, so that can be good. Others, to keep up, I really have to visit them every day.
Even though Ning is different, the way it's set up, I think some people are moving there, or elsewhere.
I totally agree that this is way too much for one person. Darren has too much work to do. I think it is highly unfair and unreasonable to expect one person to be able to do everything. I think there was a staff of 15 maybe when I first joined?
Let me look at the About page here:
sanfrancisco.tribe.net/templa...bout.vm
Pete Butler, Gary Chou, Marshall Halford, Brian Lawler, Jennifer Snyder, Elliot Loh, Noah Mercer, Chris Law. That's eight people anyway, that still have profiles here and that I remember talking to. Patti too. Um...who else...??? That's nine. There were Tribe.net people all over. And we did have bugs back then, and they were worked on, and some were fixed and some weren't. So even with nine times the people, it still wasn't perfect.
How can the boss of Tribe think that one person can do it all? It makes no sense to me. And I wish they could be straight about what has happened and why.
I do wish it could get better. But there aren't enough people to make it work. And Tribe.net still has to decide on their market. In my opinion. Focus in on a particular segment, make the rules, the layout, the advertising for that segment only. Period.
Magazines. Magazines do not try to appeal to all members of society. Modern Bride won't appeal to Low Rider magazine buyers. I head right for the House and Home magazines, house plans, home decor, and pass by the cheesecake cover of Low Rider with a hot car and the "lethal weapon 15 pound special issue" of Bride's magazine. Neither is my interest. Right at the moment. Someone else is savoring the images in a chef's magazine, and I glance at my cart full of microwave meals. Nope, right now, the cooking isn't much of an interest.
Tribe is trying to provide for all those interests, and then some. It's not going to work. The groups aren't separate enough to be separate. If that makes sense. I suggested separation. Two versions, sort of a Family-friendly, G-rated Tribe. And separated an adult-oriented (not meaning all-porn all the time) that is R to X rated for language and nudity.
Family Tribe could be for teens too. And move all the recipe things, crafts, etc to Family area. Movies, trivia, sports. Music. Various support forums. Parenting. Gardening. Business.
And the separate one that is more lifestyle and language differences. Kind of like real life? There are different places for different things. One does not have a chugging contest at church. So there could be nightclubs and all the burningman stuff.
I guess that's sort of wanting the old Mature ratings. That didn't work, did it? Oh well. -
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Re: Tribe members declining
Thu, February 14, 2008 - 10:32 PMi like lowrider magazine. and i like quilting magazines. and cooking ones. and political ones. and sometimes i go stand over by the porn mag section, and make alot of noise, just to make the guys over there nervous. hee hee. -
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Re: Tribe members declining
Thu, February 14, 2008 - 10:43 PMSometimes I page through a Heavy Metal to see the state of printing technology.
Private tribes show more activity than they used to, on average. I'm in maybe about 20. Public tribes are distilling down to their core players, though, for sure. -
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Re: Tribe members declining
Thu, February 14, 2008 - 10:44 PMThat's because private/semiprivate tribes rock!
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Re: Tribe members declining
Fri, February 15, 2008 - 12:45 AMIf public tribes are dwindling and private tribes are going great, what's to attract new members? -
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Re: Tribe members declining
Fri, February 15, 2008 - 5:26 AMExactly why it is getting so quiet, people join, get bored and leave. Everyone is in a private tribe these days. I think a new member has to really work hard to get anything out of tribe, -
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Re: Tribe members declining
Fri, February 15, 2008 - 6:12 AMre: working hard to get something out of tribe
I think it depends. In my opinion there are two aspects to tribe: social and information seeking/sharing. This line is often blurred b/c friends inherently share information. But, for example, when I joined tribe, it was not at all for the socializing, but for information sharing and reciept. I didn't have anyone on my friends list for a long time and I didn't care - that wasn't the objective. But things change - we become more social, etc. But still, what brings me back to tribe are not my "friends" (those who are true friends I know how to call, write, etc without respects to tribe), but I come back for the information. If new members join with this objective (info), there are still alot of active and attractive tribes out there.
My £0.02 (for the Brits). -
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Re: Tribe members declining
Fri, February 15, 2008 - 6:44 AMbut it's not only public tribes that are losing people... 3 of my most popular private tribes have lost at least 5-9 members as of late.
it concerns me to see our beloved site falling. The less people, the less activity, the less fun it becomes. I remember when I first joined.. It use to be impossible to keep up with certain tribes, now I don't seem to have that problem with ANY of the tribes I'm in... even really popular tribes like "bad advise" seem to be quieting down.
Aww I hope Darren gets help soon -
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Re: Tribe members declining
Fri, February 15, 2008 - 11:52 AMI have just gone thru and left tribes that I wasn't active in.
The tendency is in cycles, sometimes you become active in one tribe, spend a lot of time there, not so much in others.
I also find myself corresponding with good friends via email rather than on Tribe, maybe we are all becoming too close! -
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Re: Tribe members declining
Fri, February 15, 2008 - 3:44 PMI think you have a good point about cycles, but I think it's about each particular tribe. It seems that there will be a flurry of activity and everyone has something interesting to say, then it peters out and gets quiet for a while, then busy again.
Of maybe it's just a combination of so many things - one person posts something interesting and gets others involved, individuals come and go and have other stuff in their lives or get bored and have time to spend here. That's a big one for me. I'll be crazy busy with work and school and everything for a few weeks, then I have some downtime when I can play and participate.
Just my two cents...
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Unsu...
Re: Tribe members declining
Fri, February 15, 2008 - 5:57 PMThe few private tribes I've been in are dead and boring. Nothing happens. And there's no new people coming along to start a conversation. It's pretty much the same groups cycling in their group tribes, whether it's public or private. That's both good and bad. If you find a group you like, chances are, you will like the related tribes, as many of the members are in those tribes too.
Unfortunately, if you find a group or even member of a group that you don't get along with, you're kind of screwed, because that group runs all the related tribes. Or that individual is in most of those tribes.
One false newbie move, and that's it for that group and all related tribes and all individuals in that group. As they share information freely amongst themselves, and there's nothing a new person can do about that. Nothing.
The groups may not accept new individuals. It's true. Or there is a certain way to go about joining that group, but whatever it is, I don't know how to do it. I was stunned at the reception I got in one group. And I left. It was awful. If that is anything like other new people get in various groups (and I have seen it happen), they aren't going to hang around. They will have such a bad taste in their mouth for the site overall, based on a few interactions, that they won't come back. No matter what features are offered or what bugs are fixed. -
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Re: Tribe members declining
Fri, February 15, 2008 - 6:09 PMMost of the ones I'm in that succeed are composed of those of us who have been on the service since the beginning, it's true. Even when the mod wants to invite someone else that's been around since forever, s/he will ask the group and we'll informally vote on it. It is tight, no mistake.
A lot of us have been pretty hurt, though, or have at least suffered some intense friction from *other* people that have been around forever, and you can never quite tell who is going to have a secret-but-explosive problem with someone else that you think is generally swell.
I have the problem that there are some people on tribe.net that I really love that hate each other. It's tough; it recently seems to have led to some real blow up. It hurts me, because I do take it all very seriously, that is: I think of everyone as people that I know, not phantoms to toy with. It's rough when one discovers or infers that someone else sees one that way, or expects a certain vague standard of conduct that is incompatible with one's time, abilities, inclinations, preferences, &c.. -
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Re: Tribe members declining
Sat, February 16, 2008 - 2:20 PM"Most of the ones I'm in that succeed are composed of those of us who have been on the service since the beginning, it's true.:"
Are you saying my tribe won't make it? that it'll fade into nothingness....? -
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Re: Tribe members declining
Sun, February 17, 2008 - 12:49 PM*Most*; mang; at'sall
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Re: Tribe members declining
Fri, February 15, 2008 - 1:02 PMI haven't noticed a decline in the tribes I frequent. In one tribe I moderate I did go through the members and delete obviously inactive, or never really got around to ever being active in the first place kind of profiles. You know the ones with no picture, little or no friends, and nothing to indicate they use tribe at all.
I think with the combination of moderators cleaning house, and members trimming down which tribes they frequent, a reduction in any given tribe's membership is natural. It's a good thing, even, as far as I can tell.
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Re: Tribe members declining
Sun, February 17, 2008 - 7:13 PMtype tribe.net into the "site analytics" field to get traffic analysis, you can also compare to other sites.
don't know just how useful this will be to this covnersation. it's an interesting tool.
siteanalytics.compete.com/tribe.net/ -
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Re: Tribe members declining
Mon, February 18, 2008 - 12:11 AMI am completely guessing here but I think that Tribe's poor service can in some way be attributed to the hugely successful Facebook Blackjack application. Does anyone remember the good old days when Wendy actually existed and now you never ever hear from her? Well if you are playing Blackjack on Facebook you will see her name and email address as a point of contact for anyone who has a problem, question or comment. So not only is she getting emails from everyone on Tribe but now everyone who plays Blackjack as well.
The icing on the cake would be if some of the premium subscription monies are in someway funding the Facebook application and it's running which I hazard a guess they are. I've said from the start that paying subscription members have NO terms of service as to where there money is going and EXACTLY what it is paying for. I very much hope I am wrong but I somehow doubt it. -
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Re: Tribe members declining
Mon, February 18, 2008 - 12:21 AMThis is bad news. But it makes sense to me. I'm waiting for her to answer two of my emails. I have a situation needing Tribe's help. She hasn't answered. Probably has given up on Tribe. I wouldn't be surprised at this point if our premium money is going elsewhere. Tribe is falling apart. For all I know the downtimes when they are fixing some things are causing the breaks in other areas. If you read the Tribe Bug Reports threads at all you'll see the problems just keep piling up. And not one has been fixed for months.
I'm okay with using Tribe in it's half broken state though. I'm learning to accept things like distorted avatar and tribe main photo pics. Putting up new pics that are square for instance. My current problem has to do with a tribe with no moderator when the moderator clearly appointed a new moderator. We'll learn to live with it as is, I think. I don't think anything is going to be fixed. -
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Re: Tribe members declining
Mon, February 18, 2008 - 5:11 AMI am seriously considering buying a premium membership just to exercise my statutory rights and kick off at the management but then I think I need a less stressful hobby. -
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Re: Tribe members declining
Mon, February 18, 2008 - 5:57 AMi just like knowing that i'm doing my bit for a thing that plays such a huge role in my life, in staying in touch with my faraway tree friends and learning, talking, reaching, thinking about all i see and hear here.
that's why i got the star, and for me, tho the server's been busy a couple times for me (in aust time), tribe's been functioning really well!
;) -
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Re: Tribe members declining
Mon, February 18, 2008 - 6:21 AMSarah, you make excellent points.. and your not the first person I've heard discuss this lately. The money our premium members so graciously sacrificed is coming in to question with a lot of members. I think many of the members donated so that the tribe would maintain it's service, not for the fancy new features. Though I understand tribe wants to feel they are giving something back to the members.... what they do not seem to realize is having the site up, running and functional *is* giving back!
I've also seen many people questioning refunds. It seems tribe is not giving back money that is owed. This brings up several questions in my mind.. but my main one is "Where exactly did all that money go?"
I love tribe.. I will most likely stay untill it's death, I just hope they do something before it comes to that. -
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Re: Tribe members declining
Mon, February 18, 2008 - 6:28 AMWell, here's the deal. Darren is a hardware/network guy. They desperately need a software developer (not a goddam coder!) who can put this system back together so it's not being held together by bubblegum and duct tape.
For a brief period, some of the previous people like Jenni and Marshall were stopping by on their spare time to help out. These were people who understood the software. Then for some mysterious reason, they dropped out of the picture completely, and abruptly. That one has me awfully curious.
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Re: Tribe members declining
Mon, February 18, 2008 - 6:34 AMAnd Darren is only one man.. I'm sure he is doing his best!!
Where exactly is Mr. Mark Pincus in all of this?? Seems he has Darren being his "do all" guy -
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Re: Tribe members declining
Mon, February 18, 2008 - 6:41 AMi'm mark pincus. -
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Re: Tribe members declining
Mon, February 18, 2008 - 6:43 AMIt's true, she is.
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Re: Tribe members declining
Mon, February 18, 2008 - 7:04 AMo fluffybunny,
may i ever so politely ask you to take a gander at my blog? i'd love to know what a scientist thinks of it!
and maybe make you smile .. perhaps a lil sadly at first, then wider as you feel the heart contacts and expand ...
:) -
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Re: Tribe members declining
Mon, February 18, 2008 - 7:12 AMoops. "contracts and expands ..."
but contacts kinda makes sense too ...
i love freudian typing slips sometimes ;) -
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Re: Tribe members declining
Mon, February 18, 2008 - 7:18 AMYes, ma'am.
err, Yes, Mr. Pincus.
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Unsu...
Re: Tribe members declining
Mon, February 18, 2008 - 2:55 PMWhat's wrong with holding things together with Duct Tape?
www.ducttapeguys.com/index.html -
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Re: Tribe members declining
Tue, February 19, 2008 - 3:26 AMYeah, I can hold the whole world together with duct tape and a wire coat hanger!
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Re: Tribe members declining
Tue, February 19, 2008 - 3:46 AM
we call it gaffa tape ...
i've held houses, rockstar's guitars, mikes and drums together with it in the past ...
clothes, books, friendships, my head so that brain won't fall out ...
packing boxes, power cords ... to keep soles form separating from shoes ...
LOVE THE GAFFA!
so much so that .....
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Unsu...
Re: Tribe members declining
Thu, February 21, 2008 - 9:58 PM"The icing on the cake would be if some of the premium subscription monies are in someway funding the Facebook application and it's running which I hazard a guess they are. I've said from the start that paying subscription members have NO terms of service as to where there money is going and EXACTLY what it is paying for. I very much hope I am wrong but I somehow doubt it. "
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There may not have been any terms of service, but there were very specific representations by Darren and by Tribe.net in its announcement that the money would be going towards improving the site.
If the money is going to black jack instead, then that is fraud, misrepresentation, a deceptive trade practice act and possibly a ponzi scheme.
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