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What makes someone "Plutonian?"

topic posted Mon, November 26, 2007 - 3:16 PM by  Laurel
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In the discussion on Pluto in the fifth house, someone mentioned that Sun conjunct Pluto in the natal chart makes someone "deeply Plutonian." I don't have this conjunction, but I do have Pluto making a lot of aspects to other planets in my chart, which can be viewed here: people.tribe.net/616d7705-...ed8/photos

I am fascinated with Pluto and find that a lot of descriptions of "Plutonian" people are right on the money for me. I realize this is a question about natal charts, not transits, but thought I would put it out there to get members' take on this.

Laurel
posted by:
Laurel
New Jersey
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  • In terms of technical details, someone would generally be described as "Plutonian" if Pluto is strongly placed in or on one of the angles (conjunct the ascendant, or in the 1st house, conjunct the Midheaven, or in the 10th house, or possibly squared or opposed any of these angles), or if Pluto makes strong aspects to any of the personal planets (Sun, Moon, Mercury, Venus or Mars), or if one has Sun, Moon or Rising in Scorpio, and/or has a cluster of 3 or more planets in Scorpio. I myself have Pluto conjunct both my natal Sun and Moon signs (plus 3 planets, in addition to my Rising, in Scorpio).

    In terms of "personality traits" of a "Plutonian", they would generally be described as intense, deeply intuitive, perceptive, provocative (for better or worse), and able to see things and situations in ways that many others do not. Negative manifestations can go in any one extreme or another: some can be power-hungry, obsessive, sadistic, manipulative, prone to violence, etc, etc.

    Hopefully, others on here will help you get a better, more in-depth answer to this question, as there is much more to it than what I have listed above.
    • I have Pluto in the fourth house conjunct Uranus though neither is conjunct the IC. I also have the following Pluto aspects, as can be seen from my chart:
      Sun sextile Pluto
      Moon square Pluto
      Mercury semi-sextile Pluto
      Venus semi-sextile Pluto
      Jupiter square Pluto
      Saturn opposition Pluto
      Chiron opposition Pluto
      Uranus conjunct Pluto
      Neptune sextile Pluto
      North Node square Pluto
      South Node square Pluto
      Vesta square Pluto

      Also, I was born in the Scorpio decanate of Cancer (Sun at 17 degrees Cancer), which according to some astrologers makes Pluto my subruler. Even more strange, my natal Sun is exactly conjunct Pluto's discovery point. Pluto was at 17 degrees 46 minutes Cancer when it was discovered on February 18, 1930. My natal Sun is at 17 degrees 51 minutes Cancer. And a good number of the personality traits you describe fit me very well.

      Thanks to you and anyone else for the feedback.
      • Unsu...
         
        I must be "plutonian"....I have a several aspects to Pluto. Though, my Pluto conjunctions are to Mars, Jupiter and Uranus in 4th. My Mars is cnjunct IC..Pluto is about 9 degrees away though from the IC(so no conjunct).
    • Unsu...
       
      I haven't met anyone with a stronger manipulative side than myself yet, and I do also have a strong sadistic tendency. I've realized this when I was quite young.

      Being a Pisces, I was always looking for people who were hurt, or in need of some sort of help, and if I couldn't find them, I'd hurt them myself, to have someone to heal. I've controlled that over the years. But my Pluto isn't particularly strongly placed, unless, like this site claims, a planet separated from the rest of the hemisphere will act as a chart ruler: bobmarksastrologer.com/funnel.html
      • Unsu...
         
        *I mean, separated from the rest of the planets, which would have to be all in one hemisphere.
        • I have Pluto conj asc, trine natal Mars ---the energy was way too much for me when I was younger, people were afraid of me. I hung out with the tough guys and was loved like a sister. Even as an adult, with gentle intention, I still intimidated people--unintentionally.

          But I cherish this energy as a powerful tool for healing, .regeneration, transmutation.
          It gives resiliance, a ruthless will to power, can make you a lone wolf. When used for the greater good, it's a blessing. If used for selfish gain and ego glorification, it' can get ugly.
          • Ted
            Ted
            offline 0
            What about planets in the 8th house, which corresponds to Scorpio?

            I have Uranus in the 8th trine my ascendent.
            • Unsu...
               
              Ted,

              Planets in houses show where the planets will act out in ur life. They don't actually point out innate traits. But it might appear that way, because u consciously choose that particular house to act out ur planet and the sign it's in.

              For instance, the Uranus in the 8th. Uranus shows the area of life where we look for freedom and novelty. Where we tend of compulsively feel like we should break the rules-traditions, and so on...in the 8th, house of Scorpio/Pluto and sexuality, regeneration, passion, obsession, death, and so on..it would mean u appear as a person who's very open-minded about these issues. U might shock people with ur views on death and sex. I could give u the "promiscuous" label, or maybe "morbid" label. Maybe u talk freely about death without much regard for other people's emotions, which would cause controversy around u.

              This all depends on the sign Uranus is in, as well. The sign shows "how" a planet will act out-the means by which it will try to get to its purpose.
              So, if u have Uranus in Pisces, for instance, ur ideas about death and sex will be ackuired by intuition mostly, by the stimuli picked up on an almost subconscious level from ur immediate environment.
              It can also means u feel the need to mix religion and beliefs with these themes of sex and death and view them from under the light of a particular belief system.
              • Unsu...
                 
                * IT could give u that label..That's what I meant.
                • Ted
                  Ted
                  offline 0
                  My Uranus is in Leo in the 8th.

                  What about the occult? Scorpio rules the occult and I've been very interested in this topic in the last several years.

                  Pluto in going through my 1st house by transit and will soon conjunct my Saturn in the first house. In addition Neptune has been opposing my 8th house Uranus in Leo.
                  • This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.
                    hi all!!

                    I have A 8th house stelluim, Sun, Mercury, Vertex, North Node......juno and jupiter both barely making it out of the 8th house...........so pluto issues are very deeply felt issues for me
                    life, death, sex, transformations, rebirth........are all issues I have always thought about and have felt in life........more emotionally.....and powerfully..........I am an all or nothing sort of a peson............i want to feel things to the core.......I don't have time for the superficial and like to dive deep into my own issues and try to understand them...........alot of loneliness and pain in my life.................My degree of Virgo is virgo 2 which signify : The wisdom and compassion which only the experience of suffering and isolation can bring........I was isolated, ostrazied growing up..........although I never knew the reason why...........it just happened.....i couldn't make friends.......and not one except a few would talk to me..........so eventually I had no one but myself.........so learned to heal myself and well it was very lonely and painful ( I even wanted to take my own life cause it sucked so bad......having no one to talk to)..........but it transformed me ............my state of mind/being and made me very independent person and very self reliant ...........my life changed and I started to make friends and now I have so much I don't have time for all of them lol.......I have also witness death..........and this was not planned ........ bad asthma attack........A friend had a bad attack and well I was young around 9 years old and well I couldn't do anything except watch........its like something was telling me not to move and stay ......it was weird but I don't have a fear of death and well feel comfortable with the fact that... we live to die and we all will .....but it's what you do your life that is important......so these issues do play an important part of my life and well sex and money .........i won't even go there lol

                    Mars Conjunct Pluto .......in the 10th house
                    Pluto Conjunct Midheaven ............in the 10th house
                    Venus Square Pluto
                    Moon Trine Pluto
                    Neptune Sextile Pluto
                    North Node sextile Pluto
                    Sun sextile Mars
                    Mars conjunct Midheaven.........in the 10th house

                    good to meet everyone :-)
              • Unsu...
                 
                I have Uranus in my 8th and never knew what to make of it. I'm not promiscuous by nature (Virgo Sun,Mars/
                Capricorn Moon) But I'm very open minded about sex and unconventional in my views. I also talk freely about "death" (that there is no such thing).
                Thank you for your insight! That's the great thing about Astrology, it's a continual learning process. Never boring.
            • Uranus is an outer planet unless it's personalised in your chart like when it is your ruling planet (ruler of your birth chart) that will happen if Aquarius is for instance on your ascendant. Or Aquarius is your sun or moon sign. Then of course it also depends on what sign Uranus is in, in your chart, not just on what house. For instance in Leo Uranus would be in the sign of it's fall. And then of course it's important to see what house Aquarius rules in your birth chart because that Uranus in your 8th will obviously rule the issues affecting the house ruled by Aquarius.
              • Hmmm I have Moon in Scorpio, Jupiter, Ceres, and Juno in the 8th. And then then natal pluto is in the 2nd house and is:

                Square my Sun
                Square my Saturn
                Sextile Neptune
                Sextile NN
                Trine my Venus
                Conjunct my POF

                I am fairly plutonian...definitely a "digger" ;)
                • I have a strong pluto in my chart and tend to gravitate towards others with strong plutos IF they have half decent personal ethics. (Just because I've had enough of drama....) And people with strong plutos tend to gravitate towards me.

                  Plutonian people are intense. Much too intense for other people a lot of the time. It doesn't seem to matter much on the intensity level whether the aspect is considered positive or negative, or how well integrated the energy is. It scares people.

                  Pluto people don't shy from seeing and talking about issues that are very uncomfortable to people. Even if they keep their mouth shut, there is a lot of strong emotional projection from the pluto person and people can sense it. If a PP walks into a room, unles the PP is being very careful not to attract attention- that person is noticed by almost all others in the room; emotional and personal energy projection.

                  I think what scares people are two things- for one they sense that the PP will sometimes go through hell if need be to accomplish what they want. For good or bad, with or without ethical or social consideration. If someone is not good at sizing people up then they might assume the worst and only see ruthlessness. But most PPs incorporate a lot of social and ethical considerations into their wants anyway....

                  The second is that I think PPs can often size people up pretty well and can see right off exactly what it is the other person wants to hide about themselves. Yes, deep intuitions. And I think when they do the other person knows it on some level and it scares the heck out of them. Most people are a little terrified of transformation. But most PPs I know like it.

                  I don't know, that's how I see it anyway.

                  Oh... and yes, they tend to be fairly tough.
                  • This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.
                    Unsu...
                     
                    Thanks for your insight Bluehorses!
                    With the Sun in Aquarius in the 8th house and Uranus conjunct the North Node (and Part of Fortune) in Scorpio i'm definitely a closet-PP!
                    I even scare myself sometimes. ;o)
                    • I agree about the Blue... comments I have Pluto conj Sun but in 4 so low key and I find a lot of people also into enviro interests and campaigns have this aspect or similar Sun one Loners but sociable too and the bit about talking about stuff no one want to talk about is absolutely spot on Pluto aspects can also give underworld affinities - gangsters I know someone with it in a Q to his Sun and he plays criminals on films I think this is also cos it is close to his Aries Point in Libra which makes him known for such stuff And healers Healers often are quite dominant which they need to be sometimes to get the confidence of the client
                  • This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.
                    I really agree with this. I have a rigorous... I dunno what to call it... code of ethics? Mine aren't like most, but... and people either like or can't deal with me being able to just see them and speak to that part and not to anything else.

                    I can play in surface... but I always perceive the beneath.

                    Oh!!! and I have learned how to enter a room without everyone noticing. There are some who always notice, but... yeah.
  • Unsu...
     
    I wouldn't consider myself deeply Plutonian, though there are times I wish I was. >.>

    Moon & Pluto = Scorpio
    Sun (Virgo), Mercury (Virgo), Venus (Leo) & Jupiter (Virgo) = 8th House
    Sun Sextile Pluto
    Moon Conjunction Pluto
    Venus Square Pluto
    Neptune Sextile Pluto
    Pluto Semisquare Ascendant

    These other aspects probably weaken the Pluto influence though. >.>

    ...Crap.

    Mercury Trine Ascendant
    Mars (Libra) Square Ascendant
    Jupiter Trine Ascendant
    Saturn (Aquarius) Semisextile Ascendant
    Uranus (Cap) Conjunct Ascendant
    Neptune (Cap) Conjunct Ascendant
    • Unsu...
       
      I think natal Pluto is amongst the most difficult of forces and dynamics to consciously embody and integrate into the personality. For example, the symbol of Pluto can be very strongly placed in a person's chart yet they may not, in the course of their daily lives, demonstrate plutonic qualities and attributes. What are plutonic qualities and attributes ?

      I see Pluto symbolizing, amongst other things, the deeper genetic current of our nature; the vast intelligence and powerful influence of DNA. I think women who bear children automatically become more plutonic simply by having participated in the plutonic shock of childbirth. Pluto relates to Hades, Lord of Death and the Underworld. Those who have survived near-death experiences, I think, also become by default more plutonic.

      To become more plutonic means to have absorbed the shock of impermanence, that nothing lasts and nobody lives forever. To live with the constant awareness of impermanence is to live a transformative or plutonic life. As one becomes transformed, one also becomes the transformer; whoever becomes catalyzed, also becomes a catalyst. The plutonic shocks we absorb can either immobilze us or turn us into conduits for the transmission of these shocks to the world of others. We know who we are.

      Whatever does not kill us, makes us stronger and often, stranger. Anyone embodying plutonic qualities often appears as a stranger -- and sometimes, a threatening stranger -- to the greater populace still asleep inside the notion that they will live forever.
      • Stranger only because changes summon from deep within us a mechanism to cope with the upheavals; a bypass or detour if you like, not ordinarily taken by others :-)
        • Unsu...
           
          re: " a bypass or detour if you like, not ordinarily taken by others :-)":

          as anyone can be subject to the transformative impacts of pluto transits anytime, anywhere, so then does the experience becoms ordinary. it's like the phallacy of birth trauma. if all birth (infants emerging from wombs) are traumatic in one way or another then, the experience becomes ordinary. does that make sense ? or am i going in cycles here ?
          • For a start all Plutonian experiences are intense; it involves intense sensations; pain, insecurity, deprivation then followed by pleasure, fulfilment, relief, etc, the list goes on. Plutonian experiences involve change. Births are like that; in that even if there is little trauma involved with the birthing process; life is surely not the same with one more human life to contend with. Thirdly Plutonian experiences involve high stakes; something of great value to the person undergoing it; it could mean the risk of life or loss of something or someone; the giving and gaining of power, love, etc.

            I cannot see what is so ordinary about that.
            • Unsu...
               
              re: "I cannot see what is so ordinary about that."

              That's right, you can't.
              • Mel
                Mel
                offline 0
                I see your point a little, a plutonian has accepted that its normal, some people freak about that
                • Unsu...
                   
                  uh huh...context determines "normalicy"
                  • This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.
                    i'm in the 'transformational experiences are normal" camp --although i might distinguish "normal" from "everyday". Maybe it's Plutonian of me to feel this way, but it would seem relatively abnormal for the deductions and "conclusions" that we (may) wish that we could establish as the result of our various experiences would endure as the final word on any subject. Patterns may repeat themselves, but events and our experiences of them certainly don't seem to. No matter how sure we may be that we've reached the bottom of any matter, Pluto transits seem to coincide with sometimes surprising dis-coveries that our deepest bottom lines merely rest upon further underlying principles and forces..
                    • Unsu...
                       
                      I think what makes me a "Plutonian" type -- and as someone who perceives the ordinary in the extraordinary -- has been a certain attitude of nonchalance towards the transpersonal. I tend to treat the transpersonal forces and realities (represented by Pluto, Neptune and Uranus) with the same indifference they have always treated me with.

                      this nonchalance has had a certain effect on my personality that some people have mistaken for arrogance or some twisted superiority complex. nothing could be further from my truth. i choose this way of relating with the transpersonal as it serves my public work as an astrologer and more importantly, my private work in paratheatre where archetypal immersions and encounters are the norm.

                      www.paratheatrical.com
                      • scorpio rising / pluto cnj MC /neptune in XII /uranus trine asc

                        i relate with sherpa's take on this one:

                        >>I tend to treat the transpersonal forces and realities (represented by Pluto, Neptune and Uranus) with the same indifference they have always treated me with.

                        this nonchalance has had a certain effect on my personality that some people have mistaken for arrogance or some twisted superiority complex.<<
      • Impermanence<-- this is a truly unique perspective on being Plutonian. I find what you said very interesting. I have gone thro' many many changes in my short time on this planet. most were forced upon me, I had no choice. But it's always made me live for the moment & I would always move on easily. There was only one person who came into my life and captured it such that, for once I saw permanence and tried to hold on to it with all I had. But it seems .. that wasn't permanent either...

        I have Sun trine Pluto, Mars trine Pluto, Mercury trine Pluto and natal Pluto in 8th in my natal chart. I wonder what other aspects I have that I do not know how to read or tell. But I have sun and ascendant in Aquarius so I probably dont appear Plutonian to the general public? I dont know.
  • Great discussion ~ and the placement is obviously key. I'm in agreement that angular Pluto makes for lots of Plutonian energy, especially on the Ascendent.

    I was born on the day Pluto stationed in Leo. It's taken me years to realize how much this placement has affected me.

    Presently, I have Pluto transiting back and forth on my Dsc. squaring Venus.

    I'm going to poke around this tribe and read what others are experiencing with their Pluto journeys.

    Thanks for the opportunity to join the group.

    Fluffy
    • Unsu...
       
      Natal Pluto conjunct IC and opposition MC

      Pluto conjunct Mars

      Is the most aspected planet...I believe 9 aspects...minus the asteroids




      Fluffy, same here with my Pluto transit. My DC is 0 degrees Cap. Been feeling it for some time now.
    • >>I was born on the day Pluto stationed in Leo.<<

      retrograde or direct (1st or 2nd station) --just curious.
      • I just posted my chart. Pluto stationed Direct about 4 hours after I was born ... so it was still retrograde. Would like to meet someone who born right on the station!
        • 4 hours is virtually stationed. it barely budged an inch. you had a pluto return roughly 8 hrs after you were born. was it a rough 1st day? --half kidding, but i wonder.
          the main point being that it did begin direct motion *almost* immediately after your birth, as opposed to dragging back and forth and going nowhere for your first year or so.
          i was born around the middle of probably the next retrograde period at 20* Leo. I have no idea what difference that makes. It does mean that it crossed my MC paid a relatively brief visit back to my 9th house before it stationed direct and eventually transited itself and moved on. I should look up the dates and see if anything corresponds. All of my other outer natal planets and saturn were retrograde as well.
          maybe dat's why i gets dem ol' hesitation blues sometime an jus' be hangin' roun'da crib, "wonderin' how long will i have to wait" :)
          • "4 hours is virtually stationed. it barely budged an inch. you had a pluto return roughly 8 hrs after you were born. was it a rough 1st day? "

            Well, my Mom was abandoned by my Leo father (Pluto station in Leo) 5 months before I was born ... so she moved from Texas to Cali to have me. I was raised by my Grandmother. Round the time I lost my Grandma, my mom started becoming paralyzed and went blind. Lots and lots of parental Plutonian losses ... so yeah ... was kinda rough, save for my Grandma.

            "i was born around the middle of probably the next retrograde period at 20* Leo. I have no idea what difference that makes. It does mean that it crossed my MC paid a relatively brief visit back to my 9th house before it stationed direct and eventually transited itself and moved on.......... All of my other outer natal planets and saturn were retrograde as well.
            maybe dat's why i gets dem ol' hesitation blues sometime an jus' be hangin' roun'da crib, "wonderin' how long will i have to wait" :) "

            I dunno, Stevo, if that's why you get the hesitatin' blues. I'm looking at that angular Pluto of yours squaring the angular Mars.... ahem. Maybe it's a struggle as to how use your power and energy.

            You have no personal planets retrograding in your nativity. I'm more inclined to see your being born in the middle of Pluto's direction cycle as a sign of Pluto planting himself on your MC for a spell as big mojo. That's pretty powerful no matter how you slice it.

            I'm kinda wondering what may have happened to you around 1988: Pluto squaring itself, Conjuncting Mars ... shortly after Conjuncting your Ascendent. That must have packed a powerful punch.

            ß
            • >>I'm kinda wondering what may have happened to you around 1988: Pluto squaring itself, Conjuncting Mars ... shortly after Conjuncting your Ascendent. That must have packed a powerful punch. <<

              oh yeah, i was getting good astrology lessons then! on the upside, my sex life was rich and diverse :) otherwise, without getting into details of probable "causes" and events, i was dodging lead bullets from my wife's boyfriend's gun, and there were a couple of exciting car chases --i prevailed in a high speed interstate demolition derby (ford truck vs. volvo wagon --odds heavily in my favor, but technically speaking, i wasn't the provocateur). I did sustain a lot of other property theft and damage. and in the end, i did learn to be a bit more cautious with my words and deeds.
              also, a very close friend committed suicide around the time it all began.
              it lasted a long time! pluto crossed both my asc and mars 3 times over probably the maximum possible time period. I think it was on the final pass that transiting mars joined in on the action.
              seriously, i had a really fantastic astrologer/councilor during that time who i credit with helping me "own" responsibility for all of it (and thus, i believe, come through relatively unscathed), even though some of the other players in the script were playing obviously villainous roles in the whole movie. If I could sum up the lesson, it would be that i learned not to assign blame or harbor anger.
              • another detail and point: transiting pluto and mars were exactly conjunct on the final over my natal mars (or was it the asc? they're about 2* apart) --and it was at least a year later before an ouitstanding arrest warrant was withdrawn, during which time I lived out of my truck without a valid drivers license . . . fearful times indeed . . . nothing remotely comparable during the nearly 20 years since then, thank goodness!
              • " i wasn't the provocateur). I did sustain a lot of other property theft and damage. and in the end, i did learn to be a bit more cautious with my words and deeds.
                also, a very close friend committed suicide around the time it all began.
                it lasted a long time! pluto crossed both my asc and mars 3 times over probably the maximum possible time period. I think it was on the final pass that transiting mars joined in on the action.
                seriously, i had a really fantastic astrologer/councilor during that time who i credit with helping me "own" responsibility for all of it (and thus, i believe, come through relatively unscathed), even though some of the other players in the script were playing obviously villainous roles in the whole movie. If I could sum up the lesson, it would be that i learned not to assign blame or harbor anger."

                Holy crap, dude! I reckoned something was up when I saw Mars sitting on your Asc and knew Pluto had passed by twenty years ago. Your Pluto/Asc experiences definitely qualifies for hall of fame status.

                I'm not surprised you weren't the "provocateur". I've noticed that Pluto transiting the Asc seems to bring on the provokers. I had a Pluto/Asc by progression and got a gun stuck in my face.

                There's nothing like a good astro/counselor. I've had some readings that have really helped me through some rough patches. Your coming out of it without assigning blame or harboring tells me you learned the Plutonian lesson of transformation. Wonder if they give out Plutonian biscuits when we "get it", lol.
        • Hope you're still active here, Bunny. Just discovered this group yesterday. Here are my stats: Cap rising -- 03Cap26 -- and am feeling the current Pluto transit extra intensely as it opposes my Mars at 01Can on my DC. Pluto stationed direct just 1 min 34 sec before I was born. Natally, in Placidus, Pluto is in my 8th house. In Porphyry, it's in my 9th. In my progressed Porphyry, it's back in the 8th. Progressed MC in Scorpio. Intense times!
  • Well, I have 4 planets in the 8th house, does that make me a Plutonian? I would think so, since I'm so heavily influenced by it.
    • Well, your having a loaded 8th house is definitely a call for Plutonian transformation.

      I use traditional rulerships (which doesn't include Pluto as a house or planet ruler), but I do recognize Pluto's energies manifesting in the 8th affairs ... definitely.

      Your chart screams Mars from where I sit!! Mars rules your 8th house (using traditional rulership), your Sun is exalted in the Martian Aries, you have a three planet Stellium in Aires (ruled by Mars) ... and then Pluto opposes Mars.

      I see Pluto as a different octave of Mars .... an octave that can help the Martian energy of going forward in life get done in a transformative and powerful way.

      Your chart implies you'd make a kick-ass therapist. I'd hire you, lol

      ß
      • *smirks*

        Therapist- I couldn't detach myself well enough to do that well, that was why I ever changed my major from Psychology to General studies, but now I see I can be something better with it, a Research Psychologist- so it's going to change back to Psychology.

        I do give very good advice though.

        Mm, I know I have four planets in Aries- how come it isn't a four planet stellium instead of a three one? Sun, Mercury, Venus & Moon
        • Lol ... I hear you about not being able to detach. You're wise to recognize that and apply your talents to research. Lack of detachment is why I didn't go pro with astrology and focused on being a countess (bean counter). It's taken me to a nice gig in the film industry ... where I can be even more detached, lol.

          Your Sun is too far away by orb at 2 degrees Aires to join the Stellium Party. Stelliums are can be three or more planets that are squeezed into an orb of 12 degrees. Your Sun, being 15 degees away from the Moon, disqualifies for the Stellium status.

          I have a super-charged Martian chart as well and am really feeling Mars these days ... him being so close and all to Earth. BTW, you and my Grandson share a birthday!

          ß
  • Constant self-improvement is one thing I've noticed. And just getting to the core of an issue without wasting words.

    I can pretty much sense pluto in people- I have three trines to it and it's in my third house and I have moon in the 8th house. I just notice that there's no incessant babbling about issues- Plutonian people get to the core and just hit you over the head with it.

    And the sex thing- yeah, it's definitely there- not just horniness, but this deeper respect for it almost- like you know it truly affects you when you're contacted by pluto in some way (transit or otherwise), and plutonian people realize that. And when they don't, they act like horny idiots, not realizing what they're really looking for is change and a deeper meaning/intense connection that could transform everything.

    In regard to self improvement, I've noticed a lot of plutonian people read a lot of self help. I mean, the positive types. And when they're negative, their presence can make you feel suicidal and their words sting sharper than knives.

    And all this is so hard to describe to those who don't experience it on a daily basis. It's just so...intense!
    • "And just getting to the core of an issue without wasting words ..... there's no incessant babbling about issues- Plutonian people get to the core and just hit you over the head with it."

      Yes, sonah ... you nailed it. "core" is a very Plutonian word. I had always attributed my direct, "shooting from the lip" communication style to my Mars/Mercury in Aries, but they Trine Pluto ... so there you have it. Good insight, thanks!

      I also agree that Pluto sex stuff isn't plain old horniess, but a desire to connect on a deeper level. Sport-fu@king doesn't seem to be Plutonian thing unless there's more than a casual physical attraction going on.

      It's nice to see so many young people around the net and my daily world with such a clue about life. I didn't see an abundance of astrological and life wisdom when I was an astrology student in my twenties among my peers. But then we had the illusion of a relatively secure earth from an environmental standpoint to look forward to in our old age ... you young folks don't have that luxury.

      β
  • Pluto on the horizon. George Bush has it, exact.
    • ze
      ze
      offline 1
      i feel the need for everbody to be plutonian but disagree with a lot of you
      i myself have...

      sun square pluto
      mercury sextile pluto
      jupiter sextile pluto
      pluto square midheaven

      pluto/mars/saturn in scorpio

      jupiter and neptune in the 8th house (right now with pluto transitting on top of them)

      and still would not consider myself a plutonian... only now with pluto in the 8th, i have become a lot worse, i have to confess........

      sextiles from pluto are helpfull, and do provide some strength
      squares depend on how you treat them, they can also make you avoid pluto your whole life
      trines work together natural with the other planet and are very helpfull...

      in my opinion only pluto in the 1st or 10th will make for a 'visible' pluto person
      then pluto conjunct to sun, very obvious.... also pluto conjunct mars is strong but depends heavily on the sign
      and offcourse sun in the 8th, or sun in scorpio, along with more planets....

      pluto conjunct moon (intensly feelings and romance)
      pluto conjunct mercury (investigator)
      pluto conjunct venus (love of/or crime)
      pluto conjunct jupiter (self betterment guru)
      • Hi

        I myself am Pluto rising and suppose most astrologers would count a person as Plutonian if they have it conjunct an angle or personal planet (sun/Moon). But like you say there are other factors and someone with a stellium in the 8th would be very intense and pluto/scorpio like. I think if you have Pluto in the 8th it will act very strongly and make it very powerful. The only problem with saying someone is Plutonic if they have a stellium in the 8th is that we have so many house systems! Also if someone has lots of Scorpio I think you would say they are very Scorpion rather than Plutonic.

        Anyway how Pluto has affected my life...well there was a crisis around the period my birth (on the Asc), etc. But generally I agree with the comments above that when you walk into the room you create a presence. I can be very intense but I also know that I scare people and because I can see through to their inner core. It can also make you a bit of a scape goat and a catalyst for change for others. Plutotonic people speak the truth and if people don't like that they hear want to scape goat ythe pluto person. It can also make you self conscious as part of you wants to remain invisible like Hades withi his invisiable helmet. Having Pluto strong in your chart isn't easy but if you learn to work with the energy it can give you great meaning and depth to your life.
  • Hi Laurel.

    Well, I have Sun combust Pluto in Leo in the 12th House, which I would think sounds "deeply Plutonian," especially since Virgo Jupiter in the 12th House is conjunct Asc.

    But, by certain calculations, such as chart ruler ~ Mercury is dominant ~ and by other calculations, such as Guiding Planet ~ Uranus is dominant. Well, knock me down with a feather. I guess I just have to figure that I am ruled by a committee ~ Mercury, Uranus, Jupiter, Sun, and Pluto. I have to be a hermit because there are so many voices in my head that I need SILENCE to sort them all out. Unemployment can actually be nice. Just requires a little adjustment. But I get to listen to Peter Steele singing Cinnamon Girl whenever I want to.

    www.youtube.com/watch

    I get to contemplate sweet suicidal situations that no one knows about. I get to make it with Mars. I get to have friends who like me ~ they say ~ because I fascinate them. The most recent friend who told me that is a former family court judge. I get to dress up in 11th century costume and go camping or to a city wedding ~ outfit works both ways. I get to study philosophy, the history of mathematics and science, poetry, astrology, magic, and anything else I feel like all by myself. It took me a while to get here, but here I am, and I am digging it, to be honest.

    And you know what? It looks a lot like a Pluto Sun to me.
    • I scored a 54 on the test......not including Lilith conjunct Pluto,Mars, Midheaven in the 10 house
      • I'm thinking Pres. Obama has Pluto transiting his natal venus right now...AND SO DO I. Mine's across the 4/10 axis (T. Pluto in 10th). It's been a roller coaster ride at the office, everything from backstabbing to deception and breakdowns....a real battlefield. But then I have Jup. conj. Pluto in the 6th natally. An obession for perfection is my worse fault.

        I wonder how this transit might be affecting Obama. I will say I'm a little stressed over my own personal economy...he's got the entire USA economy on his shoulders...that must be kinda painful. I can't remember his axis though...or the aspects to his Venus. I'm just glad my Venus doesn't have any stressfull aspects. Maybe this transformation will be ....luxurious...just trying to use a good venus word here...lift myself up...you know it's possible w/ pluto to transform into sensational. Tell me I'm right someone???
  • My Pluto aspects are:
    Sun trine Pluto
    Moon trine Pluto
    Mercury square Pluto
    Venus quintile Pluto
    Saturn sextile Pluto
    Uranus semisquare Pluto
    Neptune sextile Pluto

    Plus i was born in the Scorpio decan of Cancer (13 degrees). So I consider myself to pretty damn Plutonian.
  • I took the Test some one posted the link to here and got a 50 which is high. Pluto is in my first house makes strong aspects to my moon, mercury, venus. Anyway, it may explain why I can feel so so intense, even though I have no planets in fire signs!
  • As a parent of a Plutonian, can anyone give any advice as to keep my child on the good side of this energy? What I an trying so far is to entrench in him a code of ethics.
    • i have
      sun square pluto
      moon square pluto
      mercury sextile pluto
      venus square pluto
      mars opposite pluto
      Jupiter square pluto


      ...........


      doesn't get more intense then that.



      I would say being plutonian has brought a lot of challenges in my life for the need to transform my soul and person. my life has not been easy,but on the positive side my Pluto is a blessing because my life always gets better after a purification. I am a very sweet girl with a killer instinct... I am ruthless and do not let anything stand in my way.

      I scare people, people either love me or hate me, I hate most of them, I am a loner by choice. I have a strong affinity to love and hate.


    • You cannot help your plutonian child. He/she will have to learn to struggle to help themselves. Everything my parents tried with me I did the opposite. I undermine authority.
      • I was afraid of that response Maria. Thanks anyway.
        • Sun Taurus 9°13'45 in house 6 direct
          Moon Scorpio 22°50'54 end of house 12 direct
          Mercury Aries 18°05'46 in house 5 direct
          Venus Gemini 19°48'52 in house 7direct
          Mars Cancer 14°48'18 in house 8 direct
          Jupiter Leo 4°58'03 in house 9 direct
          Saturn Aquarius 6°36'12 in house 3 direct
          Uranus Capricorn 13°45'32 in house 2 retrograde
          Neptune Capricorn 16°43'54 in house 2 retrograde
          Pluto Scorpio 19°16'15 in house 12 retrograde
          True Node Capricorn 21°37'24 in house 2 retrograde
          Ascendant Scorpio 24°09'34
          12th House Scorpio 1°45'07
          True Node Capricorn 21°37

          Moon Conjunction Pluto 3°35
          Moon Conjunction Ascendant 1°19
          Mercury Sextile Venus 1°43
          Mercury Quincunx Pluto 1°10
          Venus Quincunx Pluto 0°33
          Pluto Trine Chiron 0°40
          (My Pluto, Moon and Asc Trines Chiron. This is called a Conjuncted Trine. This is very powerful. It is one step below a Grand Trine)
          My Pluto is the Apex in a Yod and Pluto is in its Ruling Sign and also in the 12th House. Also my Pluto sits right on my Asc so the yod Overshadows my whole life. The Yod Involves Pluto, Moon, Asc, Venus, Vesta, Mercury and Zappho.

          North Node Sextile Pluto
          South Node Trine Pluto
          South Node Trine Chiron
          South Node Trine Moon
          South Node Trine Asc

          Mars Trine Pluto 4°28
          (This aspect also forms a Conjuncted Trine sitting right on a Pluto.
          Just think about having two Conjuncted Trines which are like Grand Trines sitting on the Apex on a Yod.
          Also having a T-Square pointing to Mercury.
          Very Powerful!!! My life has not been easy at all and I have had soooooooooooo many psychic experiences.
          With Pluto in the 12th I am intersted in the hidden secrets of the World.
          Just think about all those aspects. I am like a sponge that absorbs the deep dark secrets that people try to hide.
          I absorb peoples pain everyday and I am very sensitive to people pain and energy.
          It has taken me a long time to get used to this and somewhat master this gift.
          I meditate almost every day to release the energy I absorb.

          This is my 2nd Yod that involves Pluto.
          Venus is the Apex.
          Venus Conjunct Vesta
          Venus Conjunct Zappho
          Venus Quincunx Pluto 0°33
          Venus Quincunx Neptune 3°36
          Uranus Conjunction Neptune 2°58
          Uranus Sextile Pluto 5°31
          Neptune Sextile Pluto 2°32

          All my planets in my Natal Chart forms some kind of Sacred Geometry Pattern.
          I also have two T-Squares that points to my mercury.
          Which my Mercury is one of the Legs in my Yod.
          This is my First T-Square:
          Mercury Square Mars 3°17
          Mercury Square Uranus 4°20
          Mars Opposition Uranus 1°03
          Mars Opposition Neptune 1°56

          & My Second T-Square:
          Jupiter Opposition Saturn 1°38
          Sun Square Jupiter 4°16
          Sun Square Saturn 2°38

          In astrology you dont just look at the aspects one by one. You try to find patterns and see how they are all connected.
          If you have an aspect also look for other aspects that connects to that aspect.



          35. Mars Trine Pluto: There is a strong interest in occult studies which many times is accompanied by an unusual amount of ability in these areas.
          46. Uranus Conjunct Neptune: Next is 1993. Will give spiritual mysticism and strong intuitive awareness, which existed on continent of Mu, and the scientific abilities which existed on Atlantis. Earth has gone thru purification so only spiritually advanced souls will be incarnating on earth..
          53. Neptune Sextile Pluto: There is the opportunity to use your psychic abilities for the benefit of humanity; Can develop clairvoyance & prophetic ability. Have precognitive dreams. Strong psychic healing powers; desire for justice for all people. Abhor violence or anything that might degrade or oppress another person or animal.
          56. North Node Conjunct Neptune: The power of this conjunction will attract spiritual teachers perhaps from The Other Side who can teach them how to hear and see into the astral world.
          67. Grand Water Trine: Psychic energy, if used.
          84. 12th: psychic, intuitive and subjective
          103. Mars In Cancer: Intuitive, sensitive
          113. 9th (prophetic and have strong intuition),
          128. Capricorn1985-2000) : Strong intuition which will be used on practical affairs. Into incarnation will come many advanced souls. Gemini: Extremely psychic.
          131. Neptune Retrograde: There is an intuitive awareness of the subconscious mind, but difficulty in tuning in to it consciously.
          134. 2nd: psychic sensitivity can be used to tap inner talents.
          140. Pluto in Scorpio: (1984-1996): Strong intuition. Many born with great psychic ability already developed.
          145. 12th (Pluto here in its highest form means the willingness to be a channel to help those who are limited and afflicted.)
          152. **South Node in Cancer: Born psychic from past life
          155. **South Node in 8th House: (Looks like a Capital U with circles at the ends. Opposite the North Node, which looks like an upside-down capital U, with small circles at the ends) indicates psychic, mediumistic, astral or out-of-body abilities; abilities were developed in a past life and are available, * if not afflicted , especially to Uranus or Neptune.

          spiritualteacher.us/crystal-...dicators/

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