The pastor of a Kentucky church that handles snakes in religious rites was among 10 people arrested by wildlife officers in a crackdown on the venomous snake trade.
More than 100 snakes, many of them deadly, were confiscated in the undercover sting after Thursday's arrests, said Col. Bob Milligan, director of law enforcement for Kentucky Fish and Wildlife.
Most were taken from the Middlesboro home of Gregory James Coots, including 42 copperheads, 11 timber rattlesnakes, three cottonmouth water moccasins, a western diamondback rattlesnake, two cobras and a puff adder.
Handling snakes is practiced in a handful of fundamentalist churches across Appalachia, based on the interpretation of Bible verses saying true believers can take up serpents without being harmed. The practice is illegal in most states, including Kentucky.
Pastor charged
Coots, 36, is pastor of the Full Gospel Tabernacle in Jesus Name in Middlesboro, where a Tennessee woman died after being bitten by a rattlesnake during a service in 1995. Her husband died three years later when he was bitten by a snake in northeastern Alabama.
Coots was charged Thursday with buying, selling and possessing illegal reptiles. He had no listed telephone number and couldn't be reached for comment. There was no phone listing for the church.
"It is disturbing to me that individuals would keep such dangerous wildlife in their homes and in neighborhoods where they put their families, visitors and neighbors at such high risk," Milligan said.
The snakes, plus one alligator, were turned over to the nonprofit Kentucky Reptile Zoo in Slade. Most appeared to have been captured from the wild, with some imported from Asia and Africa.
'Don't play with it'
Zoo Director Jim Harrison said some of the animals would likely have become exotic pets had they not been seized.
"There's been a large trade in exotics for years," he said. "Some people are just fascinated with them."
Undercover officers purchased more than 200 illegal reptiles during the investigation, some of which were advertised for sale on Web sites. One such Web site lists copperheads for $50 each and cobras for $450.
"You can purchase anything off the Internet except common sense," Harrison said. "A venomous snake isn't a pet. You don't play with it. If you do, you're an idiot."
www.msnbc.msn.com/id/25651899/
More than 100 snakes, many of them deadly, were confiscated in the undercover sting after Thursday's arrests, said Col. Bob Milligan, director of law enforcement for Kentucky Fish and Wildlife.
Most were taken from the Middlesboro home of Gregory James Coots, including 42 copperheads, 11 timber rattlesnakes, three cottonmouth water moccasins, a western diamondback rattlesnake, two cobras and a puff adder.
Handling snakes is practiced in a handful of fundamentalist churches across Appalachia, based on the interpretation of Bible verses saying true believers can take up serpents without being harmed. The practice is illegal in most states, including Kentucky.
Pastor charged
Coots, 36, is pastor of the Full Gospel Tabernacle in Jesus Name in Middlesboro, where a Tennessee woman died after being bitten by a rattlesnake during a service in 1995. Her husband died three years later when he was bitten by a snake in northeastern Alabama.
Coots was charged Thursday with buying, selling and possessing illegal reptiles. He had no listed telephone number and couldn't be reached for comment. There was no phone listing for the church.
"It is disturbing to me that individuals would keep such dangerous wildlife in their homes and in neighborhoods where they put their families, visitors and neighbors at such high risk," Milligan said.
The snakes, plus one alligator, were turned over to the nonprofit Kentucky Reptile Zoo in Slade. Most appeared to have been captured from the wild, with some imported from Asia and Africa.
'Don't play with it'
Zoo Director Jim Harrison said some of the animals would likely have become exotic pets had they not been seized.
"There's been a large trade in exotics for years," he said. "Some people are just fascinated with them."
Undercover officers purchased more than 200 illegal reptiles during the investigation, some of which were advertised for sale on Web sites. One such Web site lists copperheads for $50 each and cobras for $450.
"You can purchase anything off the Internet except common sense," Harrison said. "A venomous snake isn't a pet. You don't play with it. If you do, you're an idiot."
www.msnbc.msn.com/id/25651899/
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Sat, July 12, 2008 - 7:55 PMI know a few people who legally keep, both, Helodermas and venomous snakes. I see no issue with it, if done in a legal manner, and minors are not needlessly put in harms way
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Mon, July 14, 2008 - 5:14 AMSomeone is going to cry "freedom of religion."
And what is up with he alligator? -
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Mon, July 14, 2008 - 11:22 AMNo, its called helping natural selection do it's thang
-
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Mon, July 14, 2008 - 6:25 AM*************Coots, 36, is pastor of the Full Gospel Tabernacle in Jesus Name in Middlesboro, where a Tennessee woman died after being bitten by a rattlesnake during a service in 1995. Her husband died three years later when he was bitten by a snake in northeastern Alabama. **********
Clearly they were impure.
-
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Mon, July 14, 2008 - 7:21 PMWell she was holding a rattlesnake.
Notice how many copperheads they confiscated. I am betting that those were for the ministers. Copperheads and even cobras are pretty docile snales. Now rattlesnakes are not all that docile. They are for the congregation. lol
But really who are these people huring why should we make fun of them. -
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Mon, July 14, 2008 - 9:53 PM<<<<<<<But really who are these people huring why should we make fun of them.>>>>>>
Well, it's about the children, in my opinion. They always get dragged into the religious settings that their parents choose and they have no defense against stupid parents. Maybe children shouldn't be allowed in churches, synagogues and mosques until they've attained the age of majority and can choose a religious following that makes sense for them. Otherwise they are subjected to all manner of brain-washing. -
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Mon, July 14, 2008 - 9:56 PMwe are always subjected to some form of "brain washing". -
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Mon, July 14, 2008 - 11:08 PM>>>>>>>> we are always subjected to some form of "brain washing".
So? -
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Mon, July 14, 2008 - 11:24 PMso, what? -
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Mon, July 14, 2008 - 11:29 PMFatalism is always used as an excuse to not do anything. -
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Mon, July 14, 2008 - 11:31 PMso? -
-
This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Tue, July 15, 2008 - 7:27 PMI am just pointing out that your logic says that if you see somebody dying on the street, that your attitude is that they will die anyway, so that there isn't much of a point to help them. -
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Tue, July 15, 2008 - 7:45 PMNo, that is what you think I meant, at all. I am saying that any aspect of culture can be described as "brain washing" by people that have a gripe against it. -
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Tue, July 15, 2008 - 7:50 PMOK, I'll accept that explaination, though I don't agree with it; because it is brainwashing. -
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Tue, July 15, 2008 - 7:54 PMno, you just have a gripe against religion -
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Tue, July 15, 2008 - 9:15 PMso I have a gripe about religion. It's brainwashing by child molesters. -
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Tue, July 15, 2008 - 9:23 PM
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Mon, July 14, 2008 - 11:13 PM>>>>>>>>>>>Maybe children shouldn't be allowed in churches, synagogues and mosques until they've attained the age of majority and can choose a religious following that makes sense for them
Well maybe if we cant get the brainwashing to stop, then keep the children in the rattling churches and there would be no more fundie adults to replace the older stock.
********covers mouth in shock of ones own outburst******** -
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Tue, July 15, 2008 - 7:08 AM<Well, it's about the children, in my opinion. They always get dragged into the religious settings that their parents choose and they have no defense against stupid parents. Maybe children shouldn't be allowed in churches, synagogues and mosques until they've attained the age of majority and can choose a religious following that makes sense for them. Otherwise they are subjected to all manner of brain-washing.>
Bingo!
or
But mommy why does the floor move? -
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Tue, July 15, 2008 - 7:19 AMI think you guys just don't like religion, and seem to have no issue about forcing that belief onto others -
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Tue, July 15, 2008 - 8:14 AMI grew up in a Baptist household and we had a pet snake... I don't see what the big deal is. It would be a violation of my family's rights just as it is a violation of these snake-handlers rights for law enforcement to do this to them. I'm not religious myself so I didn't do any ceremonies with the snake, but feeding it was fun as a little kid and I don't see why I shouldn't be able to involve a snake in a religious ceremony if I ever chose to handle one. My body, my choice. Driving cars is pretty dangerous, too, but we are allowed to do it. -
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Tue, July 15, 2008 - 2:51 PMI think the violations might be due to collecting the animals from the wild (I believe you need a permit for this) and there are usually permits required with owning venomous animals (this various from the municipal level). But it could be that Kentucky just has a law against snake handling, like Georgia
-
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Tue, July 15, 2008 - 6:28 PM<I think you guys just don't like religion, and seem to have no issue about forcing that belief onto others>
Maybe we don't. But nobody is forcing this on anybody. Don't like the thread don't read it.
Some people here don't like liberals. They are not forcing that on anybody just stating their view. If liberals don't like it they can stop reading or speak out.
-
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Tue, July 15, 2008 - 6:58 PM"Maybe we don't. But nobody is forcing this on anybody. Don't like the thread don't read it. "
Hey man, I'm just pointing out the fundies trying to push their values on people -
-
This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Wed, July 16, 2008 - 6:27 AMWhen religious groups want laws enacted that match their belief that is pushing. Discussing what a religious group, political group, science group, gaggle of lesbians, witches coven, leftists, communists, conservatives do or say, that is political discussion. If not political at least conversation. -
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Wed, July 16, 2008 - 2:35 PM"Maybe children shouldn't be allowed in churches, synagogues and mosques until they've attained the age of majority and can choose a religious following that makes sense for them. Otherwise they are subjected to all manner of brain-washing."
"so I have a gripe about religion. It's brainwashing by child molesters. "
I find these statements just as ignorant and offensive as the assholes who view all Muslims as terrorists and radicals.
-
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Wed, July 16, 2008 - 9:04 PMI can see how the blandishment of "child molesters" could be offensive, but I don't understand what is offensive about:
>>"Maybe children shouldn't be allowed in churches, synagogues and mosques until they've attained the age of majority and can choose a religious following that makes sense for them. Otherwise they are subjected to all manner of brain-washing."<<
I could be biased; I firmly agree with that proposal, but - why do you find it "ignorant and offensive" exactly?
I see no quality or substance of value in inculcating a child in a belief system which stresses that implausible and unverifiable assertions must be necessarily accepted as "true" and *acted upon* as if they are true. I see that as specious, ridiculous, and (arguably (I guess)) dangerous, in fact.
Aside from that, though, how is the expression of that position "offensive"? Is it more offensive than "My god damns people like you"? -
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Wed, July 16, 2008 - 9:14 PMA passage from The God Delusion, Richard Dawkins;
At Christmas-time one
year my daily newspaper, the Independent, was looking for a
seasonal image and found a heart-warmingly ecumenical one at a
school nativity play. The Three Wise Men were played by, as the
caption glowingly said, Shadbreet (a Sikh), Musharaff (a Muslim)
and Adele (a Christian), all aged four.
Charming? Heart-warming? No, it is not, it is neither; it is
grotesque. How could any decent person think it right to label fouryear-
old children with the cosmic and theological opinions of their
parents? To see this, imagine an identical photograph, with the
caption changed as follows: 'Shadbreet (a Keynesian), Musharaff (a
Monetarist) and Adele (a Marxist), all aged four.' Wouldn't this be
a candidate for irate letters of protest? It certainly should be. Yet,
because of the weirdly privileged status of religion, not a squeak
was heard, nor is it ever heard on any similar occasion. Just imagine
the outcry if the caption had read, 'Shadbreet (an Atheist),
Musharaff (an Agnostic) and Adele (a Secular Humanist), all aged
four.' Mightn't the parents actually be investigated to see if they
were fit to bring up children? -
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Wed, July 16, 2008 - 9:31 PM -
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Wed, July 16, 2008 - 9:59 PMDawkins is rational. It's the people with invisible 'friends' that are not rational.
-
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Wed, July 16, 2008 - 11:22 PMB, there is nothing here. It is just Dawkins bitching about religion. Show me how religion brain washes people and we might have a discussion -
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Thu, July 17, 2008 - 11:49 AM>>>>>>>>>>>Show me how religion brain washes people and we might have a discussion
You just have to be observant. -
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Thu, July 17, 2008 - 3:55 PM"You just have to be observant. "
If you can't explain it then your observation is worth shit. -
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Thu, July 17, 2008 - 7:40 PM>>>>>>>>>>>>>>If you can't explain it then your observation is worth shit.
To who. You? It doesn't take much of an observation. You just have to turn off your television and read and look at whats going on in the world, and look at history. And no, I am not your librarian, so go find out yourself. -
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Thu, July 17, 2008 - 8:05 PMYou made the claim, it is your job to offer some type of proof to support it -
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Thu, July 17, 2008 - 10:03 PM>>>>>>>>>>> You made the claim, it is your job to offer some type of proof to support it
Oh, was that mentioned in the job interview? -
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Thu, July 17, 2008 - 10:09 PMno, it is how big kids hold a discussion -
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Thu, July 17, 2008 - 10:24 PMSo, sue me. -
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Fri, July 18, 2008 - 6:48 AMFollow the meme.
Children learn from adults. They are not born with culture and language they pick that up though the cutter of adults so religious adults are by definition brainwashing their children. Brainwashing with language, culture and a belief system. -
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Fri, July 18, 2008 - 2:14 PMtribes.tribe.net/political...fdae62de6f
Yes, I know. So what makes religion bad, compared to the other aspects of culture? -
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Fri, July 18, 2008 - 6:52 PM<Yes, I know. So what makes religion bad, compared to the other aspects of culture?>
Religion is just viral marketing. They are looking to hook the next generation on their 'product'. Gee the cigarette industry used to do that and government stepped in.
Teach children language and they can read and learn on their own. Teach children culture or some society ‘rules’ and they don’t go around killing people and ending up in jail. Some parents even teach the value of education.
Does a religion teach children about all the religions so they can choose? (Besides the Quakers) Do they just indoctrinate the aspects of their religion while teaching the young mind why the others are inferior or wrong. -
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Fri, July 18, 2008 - 7:05 PMReligion is just viral marketing. They are looking to hook the next generation on their 'product'. Gee the cigarette industry used to do that and government stepped in.
So is culture, in general. Again, how is religion different then any other aspect of culture?
PS not to mention, cigarettes cause physical damage. You never demonstrated that religion is a harm to ones health
"Teach children language and they can read and learn on their own. Teach children culture or some society ‘rules’ and they don’t go around killing people and ending up in jail. Some parents even teach the value of education. "
So you are saying that religion has no inherrent value?
"Does a religion teach children about all the religions so they can choose? (Besides the Quakers) Do they just indoctrinate the aspects of their religion while teaching the young mind why the others are inferior or wrong."
You didn't grow up learning that America was the most awesome place on earth? You think the Chinese teach their children how great the Japanese medical system is? That Mao was responsible for the deaths of millions? You think the Cubans dwell on the many people slaughtered for the revolution? And the french, fuck, don't even get me started on the french
-
-
-
Re: Religious snake-handlers busted in Kentucky
Fri, July 18, 2008 - 3:53 PM
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-