fuck economy

topic posted Sat, January 26, 2008 - 7:30 AM by  root
economy blah blah blah economy blah blah blah....
uhhh, so who's with me in feeling like the whole "economic downturn" is a good thing?
fuck, everyone it seems is in agreement over the need to "do something to help/fix the economy"
i even hear "heads" say it.
what the fuck is "the economy?"
uhhh, the term we use to describe the strength of the death machine.
the stronger the economy
the faster the pace of the conversion of life into death.
so where is the joy?
fuck economy
these are good omens.
posted by:
root
  • Re: fuck economy

    Sat, January 26, 2008 - 11:39 AM
    If your not invested in the system, it has little effect on your life. After all "economy" is nothing more then a shell game manipulated by the global elite.

    Nothing ventured, nothing lost...
  • Re: fuck economy

    Sun, January 27, 2008 - 3:17 AM
    one can only hope that severe economic downturn in the US = fall of the empire. unfortunately, I think we're still a little ways off from that...there is still that gigantic metal beast heart in the war machine that will keep at least 1 aspect of the US "economy" hunkered down and "producing" for some time to come.

    in my opinion - let the dollar slip, let the rich choke on their excess, let the "authorities" feel the pressure and pain they created for themselves. the rest of us can go hiking, grow some vegetables, or get crafty without even touching the "economy" !!
    • Re: fuck economy

      Sun, January 27, 2008 - 7:57 AM
      Unfortunately, that's not how the economy works. The poor feel the effects LONG before the rich, so you'll see no rich choking on their excess until you see poor dropping dead from starvation.

      Sad that modern capitalism forgot it's Lockian Proviso (and other related Lockian concepts, like the "hand's on" proviso). Couple that with debt-based currency and the Fed's harming attempts to control inflation (but not inflationary & deflationary forces) and thus the self-destructive "need" for constant growth, and you stare in the face of disaster.

      The best thing that could happen to the economy right now is to see $6/gallon gas prices and the collapse of corporate (including farm) subsidies.

      Pain forces change.
      • Re: fuck economy

        Sun, January 27, 2008 - 7:47 PM
        i know full well that the poor feel the choke before the rich. what i meant was, that if it comes to it - and gas tops what normal people can afford, etc, etc...the rich will be forced to deal with a hungry mob...their excesses will eventually eat them up in the end and there are 300 million angry and poor amerikans for those 1 million amerikans to deal with in the end..
        • Re: fuck economy

          Mon, January 28, 2008 - 6:30 AM
          True enough, if it actually comes to that (again). Not sure it will without a complete collapse of the dollar, though. I certainly hope it doesn't. It would be nice to see incremental change where the majority of people embrace environmental awareness, the aforementioned Lockian proviso(s), personal responsibility, and similar, so that we don't have to see the atrocities that would accompany serious economic collapse.

          It would also be nice if Santa were real, though.....
          • Re: fuck economy

            Wed, January 30, 2008 - 4:25 AM
            If only we could plug people out of their passive information receptiveness... historically when times get tough the rich, or "nouveau-riche" - who are up and coming, simply refocus the attention of the "poor" into areas that suit them. War of independence, NY Irish mobs, American civil war and emancipation = black drafting etc. Ironically good does come from this too [more rights, liberation, green washing ends up spreading green ideas indirectly etc.] - but really the key is information, knowledge.... if the pumps just run dry, the poor will suffer and the government will just say 'its his fault' and the public will mob who ever they point at [most likely some country in another foreign land that needs to be 'democratized' or 'liberated'].

            As already commented upon, recessions are times when the middle class dissolves and the poor get poorer and the rich get richer - this occurs because as the middle class loose work/financial means, they loose businesses and property [to banks and institutions or to competitors which are larger = more resilient]. So really recessions are just bad things for everyone [except the top %].

            Have you guys seen:

            www.storyofstuff.com/

            It's rather good info for people unaware of what our culture is doing to the world, and a good piece to spread around so that people are a bit more conscious-aware of the world we live in and the consequences of our choices.

            If any change is going to happen, it's by people being more informed, not by having less food/oil.
            • Re: fuck economy

              Wed, January 30, 2008 - 4:27 AM
              [although less food/oil will make some people "wake-up" - so the idea is to time it so that new-positive-information is latent so that when they do get that alarm bell, they don't just become 'reactive' because they have no idea what is going on or why it is happening...
  • Re: fuck economy

    Fri, February 8, 2008 - 9:29 AM
    If it was only so simple. But saying fuck economy doesn't make it go away. Nor is there any place you can go where it can't reach you.
    • Re: fuck economy

      Tue, February 12, 2008 - 4:35 PM
      Think of Mahatma Gandhi squatting at the beach, making salt. He knew how to say "fuck you, economy" or at least "fuck you British empire". Make it yourself and then maybe you will be free.
    • Re: fuck economy

      Mon, February 18, 2008 - 12:33 PM
      "If it was only so simple. But saying fuck economy doesn't make it go away. Nor is there any place you can go where it can't reach you."


      bullshit.
      • Re: fuck economy

        Mon, February 18, 2008 - 1:23 PM
        I second that bullshit with an amen.
        By the way, I'm new here.

        *waves*
        • Re: fuck the economy

          Mon, February 18, 2008 - 2:02 PM
          I guess ya'll mean you think there are places to go where it can't reach you, as saying "fuck it" sure doesn't make it go away. You are right, depending on your definition of "reach you". I don't think there is anywhere where the air and even animals and plants have not picked up molecules of the strange and toxic pollutants of industrial society. But there are places where we can live lives which, compared to cities or suburbs, are much cleaner and where trees outnumber people by hundreds or thousands to one.

          But back to the initial meaning of the thread, and i agree. Let the whole rotten mess fall. We'll compost the garbage and bullshit of the past, and grow a much better world instead.
          • Re: fuck the economy

            Mon, February 18, 2008 - 9:10 PM
            Thanks, Wil. I guess I see so many generalizations thrown around, I like the specifics better, personally.
            • Re: fuck the economy

              Tue, February 19, 2008 - 12:39 AM
              yeah, more specifics. i'm breaking my head trying to figure how to do this. my partner and i wouldn't mind building some kind of cheap housing structure on a cheap piece of land and dropping out. but even that's going to take money. as of now, we live really small and cheap and he's miserable here in the city where he has a job. i've heard of cheap land in NM (that's still purchased land, of course). I have friends who have dropped out to michigan and bought a little house on a little land and have a little savings. they are sitting by their wood burning stove playing board games and snow shoeing their days away. it sounds kind of idyllic if the cold doesn't scare you. (it doesn't scare them, but it does scare me.) we've thought about a tipi -- not too expensive and we could live in it 5-10 years. we're having a baby and that complicates things. how do we fuck the economy on that? thinking of unassisted home birth. my partner has some health issues too. if we leave society without health care for him, i'd be afraid for his life. i like ran prieur's writing on getting out. sometimes it's hard to run immediately and maybe some planning is required. we're open to ideas and searching. not digging this concrete treeless world or the crazy hours my partner is working.
              • Re: fuck the economy

                Tue, February 19, 2008 - 3:16 AM
                N.M has a problem with water. I've good friends here who came from there, and they say that they liked it a lot, but that it is much easier here. It is much easier if you pick a place where there is already a strong alterNative community. You should visit here, H.P. Were closer than other places you are considering, and have a very strong alternative community. Land might be cheaper in other places, but the land is good here, and the water clean and plentiful. There are people here to help you get started at a new lifestyle that you are unfamiliar with. Good number of back to the land jews, and lots of new jersey refugees. It is an excellent place to raise kids. I think it is likely the largest east coast grouping of rural, family oriented alternatives. Very specific and practical. This is a good place.
                • Re: fuck the economy

                  Tue, February 19, 2008 - 7:56 AM
                  i will talk to my partner about it. is there some work to be had out there? where would you recommend hanging out? any places where people post about housing to be had in floyd?
        • Re: fuck economy

          Tue, February 19, 2008 - 5:11 PM
          Your' re in denial if you think that there is some place left were you can be immune from the economy. And if it was they would make sure that it wasn't as soon as you arrived
          • Re: fuck economy

            Tue, February 19, 2008 - 7:58 PM
            >>And if it was they would make sure that it wasn't as soon as you arrived <<

            ?<> Obvious speculation about something you know nothing about. There are folks that have removed themselves from the system, just because because thats not your reality does'nt mean it does'nt exsist...
            • Re: fuck economy

              Wed, February 20, 2008 - 1:26 AM
              "There are folks that have removed themselves from the system, just because because thats not your reality does'nt mean it does'nt exsist."

              I think that depends a lot on what you define as the system. Is living without a straight job and off the grid removing yourcellf from the system? Sure, but not completely. I've known a lot of back to the landers, hermits, and edgy world travelers in my day, and i've never ever seen anyone who i think completely removed themcellves from the world's economic system. I've talked to full blooded Mayans in the wilds of Quiche, and they were most certainly not removed from the world economic system. Far from it. I think these terms are way too vague to be definitive about like this. But for the most part, i think nodedog has it right.

              Also i see no reason to say stuff like " speculation about something you know nothing about" What is the use of saying that? It is simply insulting and combative. Lets discuss these topics in an atmosphere of thoughtfulness and mutual respect.
              • Re: fuck economy

                Wed, February 20, 2008 - 1:30 AM
                Without the "the" , "fuck economy" sounds like the opening of a diatribe against thrift, or perhaps a reference to the economics of the sex trade.
            • Re: fuck economy

              Wed, February 20, 2008 - 4:41 PM
              How do you know what I do or don't know about. That is speculation on your part. Somewhere in this New Mexico was mentioned as a place to go. This is where I live so I do know about land prices here, or the huge drain on the aquifers in places where there is water. Mostly what I was objecting to was this macho bravado about fucking the system. Perhaps with a little humility and some thought instead of testosterone you might make it somewhere.

              Recovering from Western Civilization is has more to do with seeing how we are addicted to it and how dysfunctional it and we are. If this was a 12 step program one might first realize their/our powerlessness over it. This doesn't mean necessarily that we need to cave in, but it does point out how pervasive it is.
              • Re: fuck economy

                Wed, February 20, 2008 - 7:21 PM
                Wow! Testosterone and everything... hurt feeling even, and all over my last post? LOL

                Get over it!

                Its obvious 99.9% of humans are effected to one degree or another by economy, be it global, federal, state, or even the barter system. How invested in them are you? What happens to you when they implode? Is it gonna be like getting hit by a train or stubbing your toe?

                Why all the mental masterbation, and hurt feelers?
                • Re: fuck economy

                  Thu, February 21, 2008 - 2:48 AM
                  You might not realize it, Michael, but your first post was combative, and that's why the response. " Obvious speculation about something you know nothing about" is insulting. No big deal. I certainly read worse every day, or every hour, but that is why you got bristly responses.

                  I strongly suspect you made up the 99.9%, figuring for sure there's .1% somewhere who are unaffected. Maybe so, i don't know, but i know none of us is in that small number, as we are using computers and the internet.

                  For real, when the economy goes down, our relationships with each other are our most valuable asset. We will be forced to cooperate. Good i say. That is what we are designed to do.

                  I think the barter system will explode rather than implode, meaning that barter is what we turn to when the money economy goes down. Local economies become much more important as the macro economy becomes less important. I think we should look to the coming changes as an opportunity for greater community and local awareness, and not worry about getting hit by the train. But then i'm in a good neighborhood for such cooperation, and i guess folks in cities aren't in such a comfortable situation. The rural blue ridge county i live in has many people who have been expecting an economic collapse for decades, and have dug in quite well with off the grid electric systems, big gardens, etc. Very good water sources, and most importantly, a strong community spirit of cooperation.

                  I'll say again: our ability to cooperate fairly and lovingly with each other is absolutely critical to our survival, and by far our biggest asset.


              • Re: fuck economy

                Sun, February 24, 2008 - 5:25 PM
                I was probably a little harsh in my reactions, for this I apologize. Some time ago, I read Ishmael, the story of the gorilla who could talk. He felt that he had something to teach us which was about captivity. I totally agree "fuck the eoconomy'. This economy is concentrating the wealth more and more in the hands of the few, causing many to either die or live in abject misery. I would have to say say that we must be truely insane.

                Have said some things but really I don't have a clue. How can we get out of this? I like the idea of bartering that was mentioned, and other kinds of exchange that just move through the spaces within this evil, greedy, economy that seems to be everywhere. My friend thinks that maybe aliens will come down and pick us up. I only wish that is were true.
                • Re: fuck economy

                  Tue, February 26, 2008 - 6:30 AM
                  Yes the economy is in grave danger. However as much as I live a simple life, it affects me. I am a bodyworker. When peoples funds go down, so does self care. Then my bills don't get paid. I am not a crazy consumer. The most I buy are CD's, food, and sometimes clothes. We do not live in a society of trade where kindness sustains us. I would gladly trade a massage for food, shelter, and clothes, unfortunately it's not like that. I have traded for many things in the past, but it is not enough to sustain me or keep me warm. We recently bought a new couch and put it on our card. We are now feeling its sting. I am now realizing the credit cards are another form of control. It's the ultimate consumer ticket to stuff that's unnecessary. I paid off my other one and will never get one again. I don't care if we live in a fucking shack. I refuse to let the government control me anymore. As it is I paid thousands of dollars for an education spirit had already instilled in me. Now I got that hanging over my fucking head. Even in the massage world licensing is required. What kind of conrolling bullshit is that. They say it's for the safety of the community. I think it's just for more money in their pockets. They're trying to capitalize on a service that has been used for thousands of years to help keep peace, love and community. It's all a crock of shit. I could go on forever....

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