I am reading this right now. Is anyone else? Has anyone else read it?
FASCINATING book. I keep wanted to quote everything I read from it. It explains so much, and shatters so many commonly-held beliefs. I'll be very interested to see where he goes with it.
If anyone else is reading it, there are some topics in it i'd love to discuss further....
FASCINATING book. I keep wanted to quote everything I read from it. It explains so much, and shatters so many commonly-held beliefs. I'll be very interested to see where he goes with it.
If anyone else is reading it, there are some topics in it i'd love to discuss further....
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New York City
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Re: Myth of Monogamy
Mon, January 15, 2007 - 6:51 PMThis book is required reading in my opinion, for just about anyone in our society!
I like how it separates social monogamy from sexual monogamy. It expains a lot about the behavior of humans in my experience! -
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Re: Myth of Monogamy
Thu, January 18, 2007 - 12:01 PMI think the social/sexual monogamy is a key concept that would be wonderful if it could be introduced into the common consciousness. I have written essays on the subject, without calling it that. I have said that fidelity is not the same as loyalty or commitment -- you can be incredibly committed to your spouse and still be with others sexually. And, of course, the reverse can be true.
The other concept that amazes me is the idea of "sperm competition" -- females actually evolving biologically to make it difficult for sperm to make it, so that only the fittest manage to fertilize their eggs. And that females often set up this competition by multiple matings, so that the sperm are competing not just from their own male, but with the sperm of other males as well. Fascinating!!!
Also interesting: the observations of rape in the animal kingdom. My husband actually saw a male mallard raping a female once and tried to scare it away. Nasty little ducks. And those poor females have no support groups to go to. I wonder how traumatizing it is for them?
so many fascinating things... -
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Re: Myth of Monogamy
Thu, January 18, 2007 - 3:27 PMyeah, the sperm thing really tripped me out the most too! how the first male who enters kinda "paves the way" for the newer sperm to go too! fascinating!
We ALL need to realize that socially -poly is normal for EVERYONE,...ok, except maybe some really really introverted people...and how sexual-poly people are almost "all" men and "most" females...
Logically this makes so much sense..it makes me look at science in a different way.....and how far back the church "condemned" science because of this very equation. That we should not fill "one" box..that "one" way of thinking is just not for everyone..that we all have our right to pick you we live with, love, have sex with, everything! we don't have to have the guilt buried inside us like our forefathers did.
I think i'm going to make all my mono friends at least borrow this book..everyone is entitled to their own opinion...but more people would know what they WANT if they realized they had so many options! so many! why limit yourself ya know? -
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Re: Myth of Monogamy
Sat, January 20, 2007 - 4:54 PMThanks for the thoughts, all. I have just ordered this book.
Peace -
Oz
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Re: Myth of Monogamy
Sat, January 20, 2007 - 5:47 PM
"I think i'm going to make all my mono friends at least borrow this book..everyone is entitled to their own opinion...but more people would know what they WANT if they realized they had so many options! so many! why limit yourself ya know?"
I keep thinking, what would mono people say if I gave them this book to read? Could I give it to my parents, say, and just tell them it was a really fascinating book? Given that my dad cheated on my mom, that would probably be rather loaded, and maybe not such a good idea. To my sister who is engaged to be married, and planning on staying mono? Eek, I just don't know. But I'd love for them to have this information, and maybe understand me a little better....
I was reading this on the train home from my teaching job and one of the other teachers sat near me. He asked what I was reading. Fortunately we're friendly, plus he's Latin, so when I explained the premise he was like "well, of course!" But I felt almost like I'd been "caught" reading it. <sigh> I really have to get over that....
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Re: Myth of Monogamy
Fri, February 16, 2007 - 5:25 AMJoan Roughgarden takes the whole evolution and sexuality thing one step further in her book "Evolution's Rainbow," positing that there is also sperm cooperation, if you will, that is a diversity-affirming way of organizing the gene pool.
Check it out:
tribes.tribe.net/sexuality...ff1108f297
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Re: Myth of Monogamy
Mon, January 22, 2007 - 8:56 PMjust posted this on ASk a sexy woman anything tribe....hopefully there might be some good responses by the time anyone looks on here:
askasexywomananything.tribe.net/th...b20 -
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Re: Myth of Monogamy
Mon, January 22, 2007 - 10:49 PMWow that was an awesome post Ang :)
I liked what you said about most people being poly in some way - flirty, or whatever. Reminds me of how people used to have "homo-social" bonds (before the rise of the suburbs)...
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Re: Myth of Monogamy
Wed, January 31, 2007 - 11:26 AMAng: I think we should stop short of telling people what EVERYONE wants. ... you know? It's an unfortunate conceptualization. It's also absolutely the last thing that polyamorists should be borrowing from monogamists.
limitations are everywhere. they are liberating. every choice you make is not only liberating, but also limiting. this is the nature of reality.
a life of polyamory is excluded from the monogamist experience. none of us ever experiences everything, or close to everything, ever. our focus should be in our own lives. we should lead by example if we want to share our experiences with others. making what are in my opinion naive or disingenuous arguments about how our lifestyle is the NATURAL lifestyle, or the BETTER lifestyle, is but a comfortable stroll into self-righteousness.
of course polygamy is natural, but so is rape, and so it monogamy. To single out one because of some ideology is really silly. We can find examples in nature of the whole range of behaviors. And just because one behavior is less common than another doesn't make it any less natural or desirable. Again, that's falling into a rather unfortunate dynamic that so many monogamists fall into. -
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Re: Myth of Monogamy
Wed, January 31, 2007 - 11:53 AMwow, didn't realize anyone still read that post. I meant to delete it and respond, but realized my point wasn't being made correctly to the right kind of tribe or "people" hence, why i let it die...
Of course none of us can experience "everything" i just think people need to think outside the BOX and realize that there honey (even if monogamous) can be in love with many people and I'm not talking about sex here, i'm talking about love.
It's a shame so many people are so closed in...i guess thats what society and religion has played such a horrid toll on our sexual and loving behaviors.
I know i sound slef-righteous sometimes....but i also think people need a slap in the face sometimes to grow and learn from their mistakes and realize why most of the world can't have a healthy relationships, sexual or not.
<And just because one behavior is less common than another doesn't make it any less natural or desirable>
of course....i guess i like people to SEE options...since it's so limited in "normal society"
thanks for replying robert, made me think about it deeper. -
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Re: Myth of Monogamy
Thu, February 1, 2007 - 11:19 AMDamn! I just got the book in the mail. I'm home sick and starting it today.....
I imagine I'll have thoughts and thoughts about my thoughts.
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