Mitakuye Oyasin,
I am severely confused and troubled. Yesterday I read posts from Jim, Jason and White Wolf in a thread called, "Is this tribe dead?" I didn't make and addition to the discussion in the thread. I won't comment on it now. What concerns me is that the thread seems to have vanished. I thought that only the Moderator of a tribe could remove a thread. I am the Moderator of this tribe and I did not remove this one. So what happened to it?
If there is some unseen hand operating here, I only hope that it operates with the intention of providing for our best interests. If there is some other process for removing a thread I would appreciate in hearing what it is.
I am severely confused and troubled. Yesterday I read posts from Jim, Jason and White Wolf in a thread called, "Is this tribe dead?" I didn't make and addition to the discussion in the thread. I won't comment on it now. What concerns me is that the thread seems to have vanished. I thought that only the Moderator of a tribe could remove a thread. I am the Moderator of this tribe and I did not remove this one. So what happened to it?
If there is some unseen hand operating here, I only hope that it operates with the intention of providing for our best interests. If there is some other process for removing a thread I would appreciate in hearing what it is.
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Mystery Solved
Thu, June 12, 2008 - 11:48 AMI hadn't realized that anyone who creates a thread can delete it. So apparently Jim has chosen to remove the entire thread.
Blessings and Bliss all,
al -
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Re: Mystery Solved
Thu, June 12, 2008 - 4:51 PMI'm not so mysteriously reappearing to say that I've been away from this tribe and tribe in general for a while. I got married, looking for work etc. etc. But the past few nights I was catching up and learned a lot reading some of the most recent threads, including the one that got deleted. I'm definitely in the pray, celebrate and get your "skills" up camp.
There is a sufi saying "Pray to Allah, but still tether your camel. "
That survivalist attitude that Jim wrote about is NOT present at all here( Spain), to my knowledge. I mean yes, there are places to study and practice sustainable living. But there isn't that feeling of near desperation/fear and everyone out for themselves like there is in the US.
Maybe because we have many of the "evils" of socialism here, like public (ie FREE) health care, public transportation, some public housing and public education through University.
Or maybe the biggie is not a lot of folks have guns. Spain has lived through a civil war and a dictatorship. I don't know if that's the reason, but it seems like people care more about others here. Which isn't to say there aren't many social problems, cause there are more all the time.
When Muslim extremist terrorists bombed the metro in Madrid 3 years ago, instead of going into revenge mode against Muslims (they did that already 600 years ago), the Spanish people looked towards the Government that lied to them and created more hatred from Muslims by participating in the Bush Regime's invasion. Within days they voted out the conservative government. Then a few months after being elected the Socialist government (which is the closest equivalent to the Democrats in the US) brought Spanish troops home from Iraq. We have a very progressive President, who was just re-elected, Zapatero, who is only 47 years old.
Sorry,I digress. ....
I'm honored to be a part of this tribe. I learn much from posts here even when I'm not doing much posting myself.
Ln -
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Re: Mystery Solved
Fri, June 13, 2008 - 11:16 PMThank you sister for sharing with us and reminding us that the "American Way of Life" is not the Universal human experience of society or or governance. I would swap your experience of civil society in Spain for what we go through here in America in an heartbeat. The greatest difficulty we face here on Turtle Island is our mindset; our collection of beliefs.
Our national pessimism is based in both our historical experiences and our institutional priorities. The saddest thing about our institutions is that many of them use fear as a means of sustaining themselves. The maintain their influence, fill their coffers, and recruit their constituents by trading in the coin of fear. This is in one aspect Marketing 101. People buy solutions to problems. Whether it is a car that is a solution to the transportation problem, a Quarter Pounder with Cheese that is the solution to the hunger problem, or a Church/Cult that is a solution to the fear of the unknown problem; the solution becomes a commodity. Our government has become the greatest purveyor of a general purpose nostrum for all of our fears. In order to sustain its market; it creates new fears. Other nations don't always follow that pattern. In general it is only our "client" states which do.
"But there isn't that feeling of near desperation/fear and everyone out for themselves like there is in the US....Maybe because we have many of the "evils" of socialism here, like public (ie FREE) health care, public transportation, some public housing and public education through University."
This reality and awareness of it is the most integral aspect to our evolution of the Elders' Mission. Much of what we are called upon to do is summed up in the Sufi saying Ln referenced. We are instructed as Christians (those of us who follow that path) to "render unto Ceasar that which is Ceasar's and unto God that which is God"s." We combine these two intentions in the paradigm of trusting in a Higher Power, while doing all we can in the world in which we must also tend to our society's requirements. Surrendering to fear and visions of doom will not find us a path through the dark wilderness.
We need to become more holistic. We need to prepare ourselves through rigorous training for the potential disruptions of our way of life. Yet we must also do all that we can to alter the pattern of that way of life to become more like the societies in which the impetus is the security and nourishment (physical and spiritual) of all the individuals. Many of us tend to think that the system here in America is so broken that we must exempt ourselves from it and become hermits. Those in that belief want to live in rural settings and return to a less technical period in our past. Our brother Jim spoke of the impending doom of the "Cubicle Dwellers." As though those people are somehow alien to us and not to be included in our intentions for survival. Why should we not instead reach out to them and enlist them in a movement to rectify the disorders within our national family? Inclusion in an intentional community is much more likely to result in the maximum number of survivors. The alternative is to become like the crew of an ocean liner in the process of sinking and make a terrible choice of who will be allowed into the lifeboats. It makes more sense (as in the case of the Titanic) to alter the course of the ship and miss the iceberg all together.
Perhaps the current situation is the necessary process to bring us to an awareness which will motivate us to make the changes in our national character to become more prosocial and proactive. As Ln said, "Spain has lived through a civil war and a dictatorship. I don't know if that's the reason, but it seems like people care more about others here." I hope that is not required of us. Rather I believe that we can learn from other societies and create, through our intention the life we all dream of. This intention is what will manifest the vision that this tribe was created to manifest.
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Re: The Missing Thread
Fri, June 13, 2008 - 7:58 PMI'm happy to see that someone has recently posted here on this excellent tribe, it was so quiet when I came back after several months absence that I found myself jumping in on more active discussions elsewhere. I didn't see the "Missing Thread" so don't know what that was about, but I've appreciated the comments of some of our elders on those other tribal threads.
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Re: The Missing Thread
Fri, June 13, 2008 - 8:41 PMI didn't see the missing thread either, but I haven't been on tribe very much.
I have been spending more time making music with different people.
This was one of the first tribes I joined because I like the idea of sharing what we know. I have been blessed to have a bit of land, some raspberries, pears and some herbs in a beautiful part of the world. Fear is not part of my view.
I have post apocalyptic dreams. The most recent was three nights ago. I was in a city in eastern Canada and in the sky there was a string of large containers (Way up, very big, like sausages on a string) that seemed ominous but I wasn't sure exactly what they were. It was important to get out of the city and the train was actually the only mass transportation that was working. The roads were completely packed with cars that were not moving and that was because 3/4 of the people had died in them. I wasn't in a hurry particularly. I don't think I was humming or whistling like I usually do, though.
I don't live in the city but if I did, I probably would have some plans for exodus.