To be happy we must not be too concerned with others.
~~Albert Camus
I ran across this quote and it made me think, haven't the majority of us been raised on the concept do unto others, etc. With that thought empathy is in order--to feel and experience what others feel. To put yourself in their position and then act accordingly in such a manner that you'd want them to behave towards you. Yet---considering the horrors of the world, and breaking it down to a smaller scale, even the problems we encounter via our family and friends.
If we become involved with the emotions and problems of those around us, even as we attempt to alleviate suffering, can we indeed be happy?
I think of Mother Teresa who dedicated her life in order to assist others. After her death we discovered she wasn't all that happy.
Must there be a detachment emotionally to the pain and misery of the human race to be truly happy? And that brings me to unconditional love, how do you love unconditionally and remain detached from the misery?
What say you?
~~Albert Camus
I ran across this quote and it made me think, haven't the majority of us been raised on the concept do unto others, etc. With that thought empathy is in order--to feel and experience what others feel. To put yourself in their position and then act accordingly in such a manner that you'd want them to behave towards you. Yet---considering the horrors of the world, and breaking it down to a smaller scale, even the problems we encounter via our family and friends.
If we become involved with the emotions and problems of those around us, even as we attempt to alleviate suffering, can we indeed be happy?
I think of Mother Teresa who dedicated her life in order to assist others. After her death we discovered she wasn't all that happy.
Must there be a detachment emotionally to the pain and misery of the human race to be truly happy? And that brings me to unconditional love, how do you love unconditionally and remain detached from the misery?
What say you?
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Re: Unconditional Love, Happiness and Empathy.......
Fri, July 4, 2008 - 12:17 PMI interpret that quote to mean we must not be too concerned with what others think of us, say to us, how they judge us or their opinions. I don't read it to say that we shouldn't be concerned about others at all. I think the key word in it is "too".
From a personal perspective, I think helping you, helps me. No matter how sad your circumstances, if I am doing something to try to alleviate your suffering, it makes me feel happier. Early in the AIDS crisis, I began to work with people with AIDS. I had no cure for AIDS. There was no test for AIDS. The outlook looked pretty grim for most people. Yet I helped people in some ways. I helped people keep their pets. I helped people feel that someone cared about them. I helped find the resources they needed to ease their suffering or to meet their basic living needs. I helped people feel heard. I helped people. And that made me feel wonderful. So while I might suffer occasional sadness at someone's situation or at their passing, the joys I encountered more than outweighed them.
And while I think Mother Teresa may not have been all that happy, I don't think it was because of her service. According to her diaires it was because she doubted her faith. She doubted God. For someone who has devoted their life to God, that's a huge thing. I think it was her service to people that kept her going though, that gave her life meaning.
Service is its own reward. It gives more to the giver than to the recipient. By healing each other, we ultimately heal ourselves. And ultimately we heal the world.
Turning our back on the world though, tuning out the suffering, that leads to more suffering. It allows the original suffering to fester and grow and it also disconnects us from each other and from our own feelings. These things are destructive. For example, many people have disconnected from the suffering of animals in factory farming. That allows factory farming to exist and continue to spread. Many people have disconnected from the suffering of people in wars. That allows wars to continue. Many people have disconnected from the suffering of people who are starving. That allows them to starve. Helping, in however small a way, makes a difference in us. And ultimately it is what changes these circumstances.
When we help, we are stating to the universe, "I am powerful. I can do something here.". When we turn a blind eye, we are stating, "I am powerless. There's nothing I can do." Authentic power feels good. Inauthentic power, in other words, exercising the power to look away, to stick our heads in the sand, to turn off our feelings, feels crappy. It destroys us bit by bit and eats us alive from the inside out.
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Re: Unconditional Love, Happiness and Empathy.......
Fri, July 4, 2008 - 6:40 PMoperating words "too concerned"...
that doesn't mean not concerned at all, but past the point of 'overly concerned' (where 'concern' is indistinguishable from 'unnecessary & unwarranted interference') ~ a point which would be measured differently for & by every person
the *trick* is knowing where that point is for yourself (& how it may change over time)
love all-ways,
mem
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Re: Unconditional Love, Happiness and Empathy.......
Sat, July 5, 2008 - 10:51 AMFuck the empathy! Give me the euphoria. :) -
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Re: Unconditional Love, Happiness and Empathy.......
Fri, July 25, 2008 - 6:55 PMLOL...
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Re: Unconditional Love, Happiness and Empathy.......
Sat, July 5, 2008 - 11:56 AMI believe that we are all at the level of our essence interconnected and not really separate so empathy for others is a natural thing, they are a part of us. But I want to make a distinction here between the level of ego and the level of consciousness. At the level of ego we are indeed separate, that's what the ego thrives on but it isn't ultimately real. This is also the level where what we usually call happiness exists (which I prefer to call pleasure) and where we find conditional love.
However there is a deeper level at which we are not separate, the level of consciousness, being or higher self whatever you want to call it. This is where we access unconditional love, compassion (because we're not separate here) and joy. If we are concerned with others at the level of ego then we get burned out, frustrated and disillusioned eventually because this level while often intense and dramatic is stuck in the illusion of separateness, its unconscious. If you access the level of being in yourself which is always there in the present moment you can relate to others in a much deeper way that isn't threatening, draining or depressing.
This is very important for people in the helping professions because I would say the quality and success of their work is really dependent on the level of consciousness they do it from. I'm saying that as a counselor myself. Thats my take on this in any case........ -
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Re: Unconditional Love, Happiness and Empathy.......
Sat, July 5, 2008 - 9:49 PMMaybe to be somewhere in between hypersensitivity and boundary obliviousness.
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Re: Unconditional Love, Happiness and Empathy.......
Sun, July 6, 2008 - 7:47 AMagreed, TOO is the clue...
we cannot live in islolation... and... we must live our own lives... -
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Re: Unconditional Love, Happiness and Empathy.......
Sun, July 6, 2008 - 7:50 AMYou've all made excellent points with overly concerned or too much being the operative words. Which makes total sense considering my philosophy is balance------I believe the closer we get to that tepid center of neither too hot nor too cold the greater the tranquility.
Being concerned yet somewhat detached could be in order because often those who seek to serve will experience burn out, especially if they absorb the problems of those they seek to help. As I've read Psychiatrists as an occupation have a high rate of suicide. And this could be because of exposure to other peoples ~problems~ or it could be those that seek to serve are often empathetic and sensitive, prone to depression?
Yet wouldn't you say it takes empathy to love unconditionally----and the greater the personal happiness---the easier it is to love, unconditionally, or not? -
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Re: Unconditional Love, Happiness and Empathy.......
Mon, July 7, 2008 - 11:28 PMAs long as you don't have expectations of things always being blissful, and accept the in between of both extremes, and even expect the worst at times, for the most positive effect.
If the middle of the road of two extremes is the right balance, than the middle between the middle and either extremes needs to be considered.
I think it's openness which is the answer, leading to infinite questions. -
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Re: Unconditional Love, Happiness and Empathy.......
Fri, July 25, 2008 - 12:11 AMAgreed. I think what you are saying is that in order to really take the middle road, you need to contemplate both of the extremes fully to fully appericate and accept where you are..
...am I digging myself a hole but just uttering that?? or am i just missing the point?
I think helping people has a life all of its own that runs along side of happiness, but im not sure its the same happiness that you can experience in your life when you are just enjoying life for what it is.. Its more of a healing or a connection that we are subjecting ourselfs to when ever we decide to reach someone elses world with our own. its much more than what we think it is.
Ok I need to stay away from this "The W" guy. your making me go off into infinity to long as I can only stay there in short stints without loosing it :) just kidding.
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Re: Unconditional Love, Happiness and Empathy.......
Thu, August 14, 2008 - 11:52 PMIn my opinion many psychiatrists enter the field to help themselves, then in turn go out to help others.
Some have yet to finish their journey to health and are taken down by the constant negative energy that comes in the door.
I wonder sometimes if the balance is simple to respect the persons position in life. We have no way of knowing what their spirit is here to learn, so who are we to judge that they are going down 'the wrong path'.
Unconditional love, to me, is just that. Accepting people for who they are and letting them make their choices without judgments from us. Unconditional love includes helping people when they fall down, however allowing them to jump again if they choose to.
As my education continues in psychology I make my own conclusions about what I think works, which I believe many do the same. I also work in a Mental Health Inpatient Unit. Many people come in there who have tried to commit suicide and some even try it while they are on the unit. Although it touches my heart and pulls at its strings, I have to remember that this may be what this persons spirit is here to experience and I need to respect that. Not to say I will not try to show them the positive things in their life and try to get them to change their mind, it just means that if I read their name in the paper weeks later telling me that they died of suicide I will have nothing hanging on my shoulders. I tried, I gave it my best, I MUST respect their decisions regardless if I feel they are right or not.
Try reading Jerry Hicks: Art of Allowing...it helped me with this same issue you are referring to. (If your interested)
Again I feel unconditional love does not have to include empathy....I feel a more accurate statement would be it needs to lack judgment and add respect for others decisions...You can love someone deeply and not agree with them, if you try.
Thanks for the great topic!! -
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Re: Unconditional Love, Happiness and Empathy.......
Fri, August 15, 2008 - 12:08 AMP.S. I believe it lifts my spirit when I help others. Knowing that I have had an impact on their lives is enough to make my heart skip a beat. Even though in my line of work I come across those who don't make it, I still can say I save lives everyday!
And this my friend has no empathy in it....just pure love, love for myself and respect, respect for others life paths... -
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Re: Unconditional Love, Happiness and Empathy.......
Fri, August 15, 2008 - 5:59 AMI just reread part of you rmessage Melissa, umm maybe love is easier if/when one includes empathy.. it then includes a witnessing of and appreciation of anothers' trials or difficulties when they arise.
That may increase the appreciation from the one sufferieng as he/she has not received judgment or I shall fix it or how could you statements or treatments.
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Re: Unconditional Love, Happiness and Empathy.......
Fri, August 15, 2008 - 5:55 AMthanks Melissa
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Re: Unconditional Love, Happiness and Empathy.......
Fri, July 25, 2008 - 12:29 PMI note a hint of The Four Agreements in that quote. Especially the second agreement; Don't take anything personally, and the Third: Don't make assumptions.
When I worry about what others say or make assumptions about the way other people act I am defeating my own happiness. It is that simple.
It does not rule out the possibility to help other people when they are in need of help or to be there a good citizen otherwise. It just eliminates the need to depend on others for our own happiness.
That is my take on it anyway. Thank you for the quote. -
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Re: Unconditional Love, Happiness and Empathy.......
Thu, August 14, 2008 - 5:45 PMI note a hint of The Four Agreements in that quote. Especially the second agreement; Don't take anything personally, and the Third: Don't make assumptions.
You know I think this is a great philosophy on paper, but not that easy to deliver by way of emotion. Emotion more often than not is knee jerk reaction thoughts that spring into being regardless of intent..... can we actually change those actions? And how do you simply observe them without getting involved, our emotions that is? Any suggestions out there? -
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Re: Unconditional Love, Happiness and Empathy.......
Thu, August 14, 2008 - 5:58 PMCamus was a French existentialist who is famous for such plays as the Plague.
His fellow French existentialist Sartre was famous for the number of suicides his classes produced.
Existentialism has some valuable insights but it is not where I would turn first for advice on happiness.
Epicurus on the other had did succeed in finding a successful approach to happiness which in part is founded on strong friendships. -
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Thu, August 14, 2008 - 7:06 PMThat's so interesting. I didn't know any of that. Thank you for sharing that.
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Re: Unconditional Love, Happiness and Empathy.......
Fri, July 25, 2008 - 7:00 PMProper compassion implies always being centered (living in Gwenwed). -
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Re: Unconditional Love, Happiness and Empathy.......
Sun, July 27, 2008 - 12:14 AMI think enjoying life is all there is, but without helping others and sometimes withdrawing to gain perspective, this can be challenging...
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