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I guess you can call me that probably cuz of my own damn laziness. I started out wholeheartedly, but now my wife and I are about 80- 20 vegan. I think that I have the biggest problem with pizza becuz of the cheese. It is hard to find a good non-cheese cheezeproduct that taste good. And full vegan sweets such as cookies are hard to find. I do feel guilty cuz of this delimma and would like to be able to call myself a vegan again. Please help. I need some encouragement.
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Re: Part time vegan
Sat, May 3, 2008 - 12:35 AMfake cheese is pretty nasty. The fake melting cheeses are loaded with undesirable ingredients and basically have a texture similar to plastic which i do not find appetizing.
On the other hand, vegan cookies and other desserts are not difficult to make at all.
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Re: Part time vegan
Sat, May 3, 2008 - 5:34 AMVegan pizza is easy and amazing as long as you are willing to let go of the whole"must have cheese" thing.
I like to use silken tofu, mashed up with spices, so it's kind of like a ricotta, and spread dollops of that on my pizza.
Or try making a creamy pesto using unsweetened soymilk or hempmilk and your favourite pesto recipe. Spread the pesto on the pizza nice and thick, and then add all your favourite toppings.
I have had good luck with the Vegan Gourmet mozzarella. It is not salty enough. so I slice it really thin, and then salt the slices. It does not melt, but it gets a nice golden brown around the edges if you broil it carefully after cooking the pizza. I have tried shredding it, and it worked just great. It helps to keep it in the freezer for a little bit, a half hour or so, before attempting to shred.
Also, try ABC cookies. Alternative Baking Company. Their cookies are so freaking good it is ridiculous. -
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Unsu...
Re: Full time vegan :-)
Sat, May 3, 2008 - 8:11 AMAlso check out this new cheese that just came out called teese: www.teesecheese.com/photos_video.php
and since this is a vegan philosophy tribe.
It is important to think of why you chose to become vegetarian and vegan to begin with.
Congratulations on all that you are doing 80-20 vegan is much better than 20-80 of course...but if the reason for your veganism is animal rights you will not be able to do any less than 100% vegan.
because ultimately you will realize that simply "liking" something for the taste is a very poor reason to deprive someone else of life.
check out www.milksucks.com/
and www.petatv.com/tvpopup/Prefs.asp
In order for a cow to produce milk, she must have a calf. "Dairy cows" are impregnated every year in order to keep up a steady supply of milk. In the natural order of things, the cow’s calf would drink her milk (eliminating her need to milked by humans). But dairy cows’ babies are taken away within a day or two of birth so that humans can have the milk nature intended for their calves. Female dairy calves may be slaughtered immediately or raised to be future dairy cows. Male dairy calves are confined for 16 weeks in tiny veal crates too small for them even to turn around in.
The current high demand for dairy products requires that cows be pushed beyond their natural limits, genetically engineered and fed growth hormones in order to produce huge quantities of milk. Even the few farmers who choose not to raise animals intensively must both eliminate the calf (who would otherwise drink the milk) and eventually send the mother off to slaughter after her milk production wanes.
Cheese= separating a baby from his or her mother.
And even in "organic" dairy productions whether it be cow, goats, sheep, whatever, there are not "retirement homes" for the "spent" animals.
ALL animals end up at the slaughterhouse.
So cheese kills.
Plus as for the torture level, if I had a choice to come back as a "meat" cow or "meat" chicken or as a dairy cow or a egg-laying hen, I would much rather be an animal raised for meat, because they suffer much less and for much shorter periods... cows suffer a horrible life of depresion because their baby is taken away, and the toll of constant pregnancy and terrible digestive disorders, not to mention the pain of being milked two or three times a day...by machines!!
egg-laying hens suffer tremendously confined four to a cage that can not even hold one hen, and even in organic production, they are forced to lay eggs to an unnatural degree which completely destroys and exhausts their little body and in the end they also get thrown away to slaughter.
the products of animals are much more cruel than meat...so if you want to refuse meat for the cruelty you should first refuse dairy, eggs for the same (and even more extreme) reasons. -
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Re: Full time vegan :-)
Sat, May 3, 2008 - 9:27 AMyeah, you gotta just let go of cheese. it's a hard one, for sure, and hands-down the hardest one for the majority of people on their path to becoming vegan.
i used the fake "vegan" plastic cheese for a while as a transitional thing, until i finally got grossed out enough. it was years after i became vegan so by that time my cravings for cheese were gone anyway, and my meal repertoire had evolved significantly that i wasn't lacking in protein in my diet.
i was going to say the same as antoine, just keep reading up on the dairy industry. just keep yourself reminded of the suffering caused by making cheese. eventually your compassionate self will win over your brain when you next decided whether or not to eat cheese.
god luck! -
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Re: Full time vegan :-)
Sat, May 3, 2008 - 4:34 PMi meant "good luck", but i suppose god luck works as well... -
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Unsu...
Re: Full time vegan :-)
Sat, May 3, 2008 - 5:28 PMI like god luck better. It rings more true.
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Re: Full time vegan :-)
Mon, June 2, 2008 - 6:52 PMAnd don't forget that the white sugar is white due to the
young animal bones from the dairy industry....
read "Sugar Blues" by William Dufty
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Re: Part time vegan
Wed, May 14, 2008 - 2:53 PMABC cookies are the best. As for making your own just use earth balance margerine and energee egg replacer in your recipe. Works every time.
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Re: Part time vegan
Wed, May 14, 2008 - 2:08 AMI have had much commercial "fake" cheeze.
And I like a bunch of it.
A few years ago.... a bunch was not to my liking....
And now.... I use "The Uncheese Cookbook".....
and it's GREAT!
For awhile we were doing "Friday Nite Vegan Pizza Nite"
And since I dont do nightshades that often..... It was often no tomato!
PS the "original" pizza was from Greece, and they did not use tomato OR cheeze.
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Re: Part time vegan
Sat, May 3, 2008 - 7:55 PMi hear you...i went 100% out of the blue almost three years ago...straight from cheeseburgers to veggie patties and milkshakes to soy/hemp/almond milk...
and then about a year ago started eating cheese again...i know it's something i'd like to do away with again, but i've been inconsistent for so long now, i've decided the way to make a permanent change would be to do a fast/cleanse (i like the master cleanse...aka lemonade cleanse) for about ten days, then start eating 100% raw and then go vegan again...it would be a good way to transition myself and prevent relapses into old habits
right now, i'm just eating as consciously as possible...and not making any rules...just avoiding meat, eggs, most dairy and heavily processed stuff of course...
i think every time you eat as close to vegan as possible helps...and i don't think you should limit yourself or deprive yourself, if that's what you feel like you're doing...it should be a clear, informed, happy decision you are making to abstain from certain foods...do it with knowledge and openness and it will be easy...if you feel like you're forcing yourself into something you should re-examine your motives for doing it in the first place
if you know WHY you DON'T want to eat cheese, eventually it will be something you don't even think twice about...you'll be so sure even the choicest slice of gouda will look bada... ;-) (sorry, i'm cheesy)
as for pizza, i put shredded carrots ontop of mine...i also make a nutritional yeast/almond/miso/tahini/salt/lemon juice blend (let me know if you're interested and i can give you a tentative recipe...i add and subtract ingredients at will...so it depends) that doesn't taste like cheese...but it satisfies me...and doesn't taste like that crappy processed fake cheese...the rice/almond/soy shit...
also sometimes when i'm really craving dairy or eggs i realize that really what my body is telling me is that i need more protein or sugar or something i'm neglecting and i eat a spoonful of peanut butter or a banana and for some reason that always quiets my cravings...it might be something else that works for you...try a few things and see what you discover.
love and sunshine,
shannon -
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Unsu...
Re: Part time vegan
Sat, May 3, 2008 - 9:43 PMalso for both Shannon and Salamader, you need to give yourself a break.
david is right, cheese is HARD to give up...and this is why....
dairy is ADDICTIVE ...no really. you are actually addicted to dairy, and cheese in particular.
cows are herbivores and calfs have a built in desire to eat grass...but a calf has to grow VERY fast VERY quickly
(another reason why dairy should not be consumed by humans, it is a food that is perfectly made by the mother of a species for the baby of THAT species...it therefore should be consumed only by that species,and only as a baby...even a grown rat should not drink rat milk and a grown cow would get sick if drinking cow's milk)
so since the calf needs to grow to almost half a ton in six months, he or she CANNOT eat grass, but MUST instead drink mother's milk...a LOT of it...and so there are trace amounts of opiates...yep...OPIATES (as in heroine!!!) in cow's milk to keep the calf coming for more...when the milk is concentrated in cheese or cream form these opiates are even stronger.
when these trace amounts of opiates are given to a human baby, the baby reacts with a strong addiction. If the baby keeps taking it in childhood, the human child is now HOOKED!
which is why all these dairy foods like ice cream and cheese are "comfort" foods that we want to recapture our youth...because we were junkies...
dairy needs to be treated like any other drug...COLD TURKEY.
and watch out for the elements of dairy in the ingredients, like whey and casein and lactose, all of those elements will cause you to not be able to kick your addiction.
That's why giving up dairy is hard...plus with society constantly trying to sell us dairy and images and television commercials with "cheesy, stringy, hot pizza...mmm" (sic) it makes it harder.
but trust me, once you are completely off cheese, "real" animal cheese will make you hurl big time...and this is coming from a French person, we LOVE our cheese :-)
I would NEVER even consider eating even a bite of cheese, it is totally gross to me. -
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Re: Part time vegan
Sat, May 3, 2008 - 11:32 PMyeah i've heard that before...and i agree...
which is why i'm going to do the master cleanse and quit cheese...for good! the master cleanse is awesome...it helps people quit alcohol addictions, nicotine, you name it...so i figure it will probably help me quit cheese as well...
i just find it strange that i was able to quit EVERYTHING else cold turkey (fast food---which i've heard is also addictive, milk, ice cream, eggs, etc.) no problem...and out of all that, cheese is my downfall...i know i can overcome it no problem though, i just need to make up my mind and do it... -
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Re: Part time vegan
Sun, May 4, 2008 - 2:23 AMWhen ordering pizza from a restaurant lately my boyfriend and I order it without cheese. Many pizza places will do this and I've had several different ones now without any cheese or cheese substitute either. They are really pretty good with just the tomato sauce and veggies. Try it. They are really good, once you've decided you'd rather not have the cheese on it. -
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Re: Part time vegan
Sun, May 4, 2008 - 4:44 AMYeah, the cheese thing is definitely a full on addiction. Once I got past a certain point with it I realised how addicted I had been and literally slapped my forehead and went "Duh!" I have always been very proud of my lack of addictions, until I discovered how addicted I was to sugar and cheese. It took a while for those cravings to subside, but once they did I could not even believe how grossed out I was by cheese and yogurt.
"Mmmmm, I'll have some toasted condensed cow lactation on my pizza please!"
I mean, when you REALLY think about it, drinking another species milk is very strange, but cheese is just some straight up BIZARRE-ass stuff.
Thank you for all the awesome info Antoine. As usual you astound.
Oh, and Shannon, that gouda bada thing.........I groaned out loud.......Ouch. I love bad puns. You should come over and make Vegan pizza with us this week. I am curious about this yeast/almond/miso stuff. I will bake the crust if you bring that stuff! :)
To swing the discussion back to a philosophical bent, and because this has been an issue with me lately that I need to get some help on:
What is the best way to explain to a meat / dairy eater that they are an addict, most likely hooked from infancy, on a destructive substance?
Thus far, my method, screaming "YOUR ADDICTION IS DESTROYING OUR PLANET!!!!", has been met with some ........resistance.
Any ideas? -
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Re: Part time vegan
Sun, May 4, 2008 - 9:32 PMthere are a couple of books written by a wonderful woman named Victoria Boutenko about how "cooked foods" are an addiction...
she is a raw foodist living in southern oregon, i was lucky enough to attend school with her kids who are a couple years older than me, they are great chefs and all 100% vegan and raw
anyway we sell all of her books at Ab. Life (and i know you can buy them online too) one is called: 12 Steps to Raw Food or something to that effect and it discusses how cooked food is an addiction in a really clear, easy to understand, non confrontational way...
i'm pretty sure you could use that basic outline and put in info. about milk and meat instead...
i think the most important thing is non-judgmental education...if you can educate people in a calm, non confrontational way, that prevents people from getting defensive and they are more likely to listen to your message and consider it...of course sharing delicious, non-animal based food also has that effect....you catch more flies with honey than with vinegar... oh and i love the vegan pizza idea...let's do that.
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Re: Part time vegan
Wed, May 14, 2008 - 1:28 AMAthonwy-
Sometimes it is sooo difficult to tell people what they need to hear. I have gotten into MANY heated discussions with family members and friends who just don't want to hear my "information" anymore. Frankly, I think they are ashamed the more they learn from me, but it is just too overwhelming for them to even begin to consider their lives without meat and cheese!
But I keep the faith.
We must not give up. Keep up your good work, dude.
Peace~Greta -
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Re: Part time vegan
Wed, May 14, 2008 - 2:11 AMExactly.... People who know what is up with "artificial ripped off cow snot"
gett really angry when they hear the facts......
and realize they dont care......
so they jump from "reason" to "emotion"
"But I like the taste" blablabla
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Unsu...
Re: Part time vegan
Sun, May 4, 2008 - 8:15 AM"i just find it strange that i was able to quit EVERYTHING else cold turkey (fast food---which i've heard is also addictive, milk, ice cream, eggs, etc.) no problem...and out of all that, cheese is my downfall...i know i can overcome it no problem though, i just need to make up my mind and do it... "
yeah fast-food is addictive emotionally, but not really physically...although the high levels of sugar and salt are.
but dairy is actually physically addictive...like miold heroine!!!
and the special thing about dairy is that you have been addicted to it since the womb!!! because presumably your mother consumed dairy...and then when you were a baby it was introduced to you very soon...so your personal addiction to it started at the age of 1 or 2 years old...while nicotine and alcohol came around much later. So it's a lifetime addiction....MUCH harder to break!
(nicotine, caffeine and alcohol can of course also affect you in the womb if your mother smoked and drank, causing developmental problems but presumably you didn't also start smoking and drinking as a baby :-)...although caffeine is given to younger and younger children which is scary as well. -
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Re: Part time vegan
Wed, May 14, 2008 - 2:44 PMHey Antoine,
Can you give me a source on the dairy addiction? It's not for me but my nit picky hubby who always wants sources. As for me I gave up cheese when I went vegan in 2000. Thinking about veal calves pretty much turned me off of milk products completely. -
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Unsu...
Re: Part time vegan
Wed, May 14, 2008 - 5:22 PMsure
PCRM Physician's Committee for Responsible Medicine
here's a commentary www.pcrm.org/news/commentary030519.html
and the actual case: www.pcrm.org/magazine/gm...ummer02.html
wikipedia mentions it as well (search for morphine): en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cheese (although they say that the studies were "flawed" conveniently not telling us why they are flawed ;-) awww groupthink! :-)
other sources: www.healthdiaries.com/blogs/v...ate.html
danmahony.com/bigfood2.htm
and regardless of the interpretation it is a FACT that morphine is created by casein when it is digested as these unrelated medical studies demonstrate:
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8775294
grande.nal.usda.gov/ibids/index.php
so one could claim that it is a leap to say that these opiates cause an addiction, but I don't think so.
(not to mention that dairy has also been conclusively linked to type 2 diabetes, autism, osteoporosis, allergies, asthma and many many many more diseases by COUNTLESS studies over the last 100 years) -
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Re: Part time vegan
Sun, May 18, 2008 - 11:56 AMThanks for the links Antoine. Cheese was the hardest thing to give up. I thought it had to do with salty flavor. Now I see it is the opiates. Nice to have some concrete evidence when talking to others.
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Re: Part time vegan
Wed, May 14, 2008 - 1:16 AMHi Min.
I hear you. It is a commitment. I have pretty much given up all "fake cheese" because I learned most of it has casein in it anyway - a milk derived product that is really bad for us. (It's used in adhesives, paints, and other industrial products. Yuck!) So reading labels is so important, but time consuming, and a pain sometimes. I agree, pizza was hard for me too. There are some pizzerias in my area (No. Ca.) that make soy cheese pizza, but I haven't tried them. Might be worth looking into, but again, watch out for the casein!
My advice is don't be too hard on yourself. I too started with gangbusters, and then faltered a bit. Now instead of beating myself up for not being the perfect vegan, I try to pat myself on the back for what I am able to do - which is MUCH better than what I used to do (eat). Hey, 80% vegan is really good. Much better than 0% vegan! So, give yourself some credit, and time to get better at it. It takes practice - remember, we don't exactly live in a very vegan-friendly world. Do the best you can.
As far as baked goods, I have found a lot at Whole Foods, and community markets in my area (I can't remember where you are). Trader Joe's has vegan cookies that are great! And there are a ton of resources online for vegan baking, cookbooks, and recipes, etc. Even right here on Tribe.
I hope this has been helpful.
Keep up the good work!
~Peace
Greta -
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Re: Part time vegan
Thu, July 3, 2008 - 4:52 PMAlternative Baking Company is soooo goooood!
(OK I'll read the rest of the posts now, just had to say that!) -
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Re: Part time vegan
Thu, July 3, 2008 - 4:58 PMI actually really enjoy the Veganrella individual slices. I just dislike the over-packaging.
And yeah, ABC cookies freaking rock.
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